New age cons
This is crazy, and it’s kind of sad I didn’t hear about it until just now, given it happened pretty much in my backyard.
More than 50 followers of spiritual guru James Arthur Ray had just endured five strenuous days of fasting, sleep-deprivation and mind-altering breathing exercises when he led them into a sweat lodge ceremony.
It was supposed to be a religious awakening, the culmination of a $9,000-plus-a-person retreat outside Sedona, Ariz., aimed at helping people find a new vision for life. But it wasn’t long before the ceremony turned into a terrifying experience.
People were vomiting in the stifling heat, gasping for air, and lying lifeless on the sand and gravel floor beneath them, according to participant Beverley Bunn. One man was burned when he crawled into the rocks, seemingly unaware of what he was doing, she said. Ultimately, three people would die.
It’s beyond comprehension to me. It is inexplicable that anyone would pay this kind of money, first of all, to sit in an oven for five days. It’s even more strange that people, once in the oven, would endure this to their deaths. The only thing I do get is that James Arthur Ray was a con-man and should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. What drove him – greed – is understandable, if reprehensible. What drove the poor saps who paid him $9,000 a piece is harder to figure out.
A couple of things jump out here:
1) No surprise this was outside Sedona. People are just a little on the hippie-kooky side there (although is a beautiful town).
2) There was a good article somewhere (can’t remember) earlier this week that touched on this story and the way that Native American spiritual practices have been appropriated by New Age folks. Of course the problem there is that the Native Americans themselves started the trend with the way they have commercialized their culture. E.D. I’m sure you are very familiar with this in AZ. I heard so many contradictory and far-fetched notions of Indian spirituality while I was out there that it just sort of got to be ridiculous. Ask 3 Navajo about their spiritual beliefs and you will hear 3 different stories. So it’s very easy for con men to steal some of this away.Report
Well a lot of that is just tourism. And a lot of that is perpetuated by white people making a buck off of native American spirituality, though to be sure many natives do that as well. You get used to it living here. Actually you don’t even notice it at all until you drive to Sedona – the nexus of new age nonsense. The veritable vortex of silly rich white people wearing turquoise.Report
Not religious, I take it?Report
No – I am religious. I have never once been asked to pay $9000 for my religion, nor to sit in an oven. I would say the divide between religion and cult is pretty wide.Report
Out of curiousity, how do you define the difference?Report
One requires you to pay to join (or to remain a member). Even tithing (see below comment) is not required by religion, though it strongly suggested to help out with a community you choose to belong to. Beyond this, a religion does not require you to jump through hoops to learn its truths, revelations, beliefs, etc. You can learn all about them even if you’re not part of the religion. A cult requires membership and usually a financial commitment to learn its truths, revelations, etc. This is why Scientology is without a doubt a cult.
To answer also the simple difference between how many people are in it that greg mentions below, I think this is totally missing the point. You could start a religion and it wouldn’t be a cult so long as you didn’t require members to pay or keep secrets, etc. Religions are open and free even if they do require certain observations, customs, etc. The demands of kosher eating are a far cry from requiring people to pay all their money to live in a compound somewhere.Report
Mormons???? religion or cult?Report
So Mormonism is a cult? (A Mormon is required to be a full tithe payer in order to enter the Temple.)
Some religions have historically required mandatory sacrifices (doves, etc) in order to participate in religious events.
Some state churches in Europe require that one be a taxpaying citizen to be a member, because the Church is supported in part by taxes.
By this definition, certain varieties of Buddhism are not religions, the Ancient Druids were a cult, not a religion, Mormonism is (again) not a religion, and Gnosticism isn’t a real religion.Report
Three fun definitions.
Totally Cynical: A “cult” is what a religion is called when it is not the religion shared by the speaker.
Less Cynical but Still Cynical: A “cult” is a religion without any political power.
The best definition of cult I’ve seen, but it’s not that funny: A cult is a sect that gets most of its adherents as adults through conversion. A religion is a group that gets most of its adherents as children raised into the faith.Report
I think the totally cynical is the best for my tithe.Report
The best definition of cult I’ve seen, but it’s not that funny
The funny way I’ve heard that phrased is: Cults brainwash you when you’re 25; Religions brainwash you when you’re 4.Report
To me the difference between a Cult and a Religion is that the former is insular, secretive, seeks to remain culturally isolated, and does not wish for others to know what they know. A Religion is more extroverted, seeks converts, and wishes to integrate or change society rather than retreat from it.
The FLDS is the quintessential example of a cult. The Pentacostals are not. Regular Mormons are somewhere in between, though I would place them more on the “Religion” side due to their intense extroversion. Scientologists are similarly situation, though slightly more on the “Cult” side than Mormons (though perhaps still on the Religion side of the middle).Report
I have trouble seeing Pentacostals as anything other than a cult. They only seem to recruit the most disaffected among us.Report
So you don’t belong to a religion with tithing like the mormons then. giving up money to be part of a religion is pretty darn traditional. I think part of the difference between a cult and religion is how many people are involved and how long it lasts.
“The veritable vortex of silly rich white people wearing turquoise”
Funny and sadly true.
The cult leader was the guy who did the book The Secret which was pretty much magical thinking, new agey bs and offensive to most thinking people.Report
When I read the title I thought there was going to be some weird group of New Age conservatives. Dammit. Wrong kind of cons (or is there a difference? 🙂Report
“This silver bowl has been passed down for seven generations of my family. It’s real silver too, none of that adulterated crap the kids today use. We also sing to the real crone. None of this beautified disney crap. Those are *REAL* pigeons we sacrifice…”Report
excellent. i can now retract my statement.Report
“It’s even more strange that people, once in the oven, would endure this to their deaths.”
It’s not strange at all considering the fact that these folks did not enter the sweat lodge, “oven,” knowing that death awaited.
If we are to believe what we read many saints endured martyrdom for their beliefs, they chose an “oven” rather than renounce their faith. Now that is strange.
I’m not defending the conman, he should and will face charges and probably years in prison. But the fact that he was able to find – let’s be charitable and call them – seekers seems less strange than martyrs willingly accepting death.
The seekers that died in the sweat lodge did not enter looking for death. They sought some purifying ritual that went criminally wrong.Report
“Cult” is nothing more or less than a word that means “religious activity I don’t like.”
It’s more or less a completely useless word.Report
If you think that Mormonism is a bad cult, you should check out this reference to a cult that existed a couple thousand years ago. It required it’s members to sell their belongings and give the proceeds to the church leaders, There is an example of one couple who died for holding back a portion. Acts 4:34 – Acts 5: 10.Report