Fantasy and High Fantasy
Alyssa Rosenberg and Adam Serwer both have responses up to my post on fantasy and the Anglosphere. Adam correctly notes that what I’m writing about in particular is “high fantasy” – a sub-genre of fantasy more broadly. I admit to not making my argument as clearly as I should have. So let me point out two things.
First, I was responding to D.G. Myers whose piece focused on the Christian themes and Christian roots of fantasy. In particular, Myers and the material he was working with, focused on fantasy stemming from the Tolkien tradition. The argument of Myers and others was that fantasy is uniquely Christian in nature, and doesn’t work so well for the Jewish tradition.
I actually disagreed with this notion, and said that this particular sort of mainstream fantasy – or high fantasy, as Adam correctly defines it – is not rooted so much in Christianity but in the British experience – its myths, faeries, and feudal history specifically, but also possibly its Anglicanism.
Second, I don’t think that Jewish fantasy is impossible. Adam writes:
To briefly address Kain’s other point about the supposed absence of Jewish fantasy writers (actually untrue), the fact that medieval Europe was incredibly hostile towards Jews might explain why there aren’t a really large number of Jewish writers who specialize in that particular sub-genre of fantasy. But Kain seems to buy the notion that Jewish authors are hostile to fantasy in general, a theory which, as Spencer Ackerman pointed out some time ago, fails rather spectacularly in the face of the existence of the American superhero. To exclude other cultures’ fantasy offerings is to define the genre in a uselessly narrow fashion, and to ask why Jews and Muslims, Japanese and Ghanians don’t come up with fantasies that resemble exactly those of British writers is to ask a question with a profoundly obvious answer.
I’m not sure why Adam thinks I am arguing this at all. I’m not. I’m very specifically responding to the notion that fantasy is Christian in nature and disagreeing with that claim. I think the lack of clarity on my part – that I am specifically referring to the mainstream, Tolkien-esque fantasy, may be responsible for the confusion. But even there I think the roots of high fantasy strike deeper than Christendom, into the old myths and old magic that preceded it.
There are of course many other genres of fantasy out there, with different roots and different traditions. Asian fantasy, Islamic fantasy, and yes, even Jewish fantasy, all help create the vast and growing pantheon of fantasy literature. And I think that’s great. High fantasy gets boring after a while.
But I think Adam is misreading my argument here in a pretty fundamental way. I blame myself for that, but it’s worth pointing out nonetheless. As Alyssa notes:
I think the point is more that, as a modification of how Erik puts it, that the fantasy that we see on the American market is “not founded in Christian themes so much as it is rooted in distinctly Anglo-Saxon mythology. And not just the mythology of the Medieval, feudalistic period, but the pre-Christian myths of the faerie-folk as well.” That we see certain things on the market doesn’t mean that fantasy is limited to those things, or inherently grows out to those things. It just means that we’re reliant on old patterns.
This is a smart point and one that I was driving at by focusing on the market for fantasy, and how it has been traditionally dominated by this particular breed of the fantastical, rooted in Anglo-American shared mythologies. I think it’s basically true that fantasy as a genre of popular literature was born and raised in the Anglosphere, and that the form has been adopted in other non-English-speaking cultures – for whatever reason and perhaps simply because of the respective economic empires of the UK and USA.
Hopefully as nerd culture expands further into the mainstream, fantasy will continue to expand alongside it, bringing the fantastical traditions of many other cultures into the mainstream body of fantasy literature.
Props for using the Final Fantasy Tactics art. (I really want to buy it for the iPhone but $15 is out of my justifiable-purchase range. Maybe that’s what the holiday season is for…)Report
Plus it’s totally broken on iPhone unfortunately. Lost of slow load times between certain actions and screens. Not nearly as smooth as the origional.Report
Yeah, it’s really wonky. Which is unfortunate, since it’s a port of the outstanding PSP version.Report
On the one hand, glad I waited.
On the other hand, rats, because I wanted to play it!Report
I still, on occasion, play the old PS version. A classic.Report
One of my favorites. I’m still waiting for an epic political master piece on par with it, but I’ve been holding my breath for a while.Report
Ever play Vagrant Story?Report
Yes! Good call! Also, I love your new avatar.
Also good: Tactics Ogre for the SNES/PSX. That just got remade for the PSP as well. Great game, and the forefather of FFT.Report
Never played Tactics Ogre, but, being the fanboy of FTT and VS, I’ve heard of it. Wish I had a PSP.Report
Of course!
I think we struck upon this in another thread a while ago. After both those titles I had such high hopes for FF XII, but none of the political or supernatural intrigue ever got of the ground.Report
I rather enjoyed FFXII, although I admit having Vaan as the POV character–instead of say, Ashe or Balthier–limited the political and supernatural intrigue.Report
I definitely enjoyed it too. In fact, it was probably the first in the series where I actually went through a lot of the extra side-quests and optional bosses. I loved the music, art style and battle system.
But, interestingly enough, the story was origonally suppose to revolve around Balthier and Bash, and have to do mosting with the city-state politics and class warfare/social justice issues inherent in the human judge/supernatural god-as-judge stuff.
Vaan as the first person center of the game was a marketing revison from what I’ve heard.Report
Your image brings to mind something I’ve always wonderd: why, with such a rich mythological heritage of their own, do developers of Japanese fantasy games draw so heavily from Eurpean mythology?Report
you’ve never heard of kwelin, I take it?
There are TONS of video games that draw from Japanese and Chinese history, legends of the three kingdoms, suikoden among others.Report
I think the gap here is that a large number of games designed for Japanese audiences never see North American localizations.
That said, there are quite a few. Kimmi points out a couple, and I’d add Breath of Fire as a series that doesn’t just use Asian history but also Asian mythological elements (the animal-people hybrids, the dragons, etc).Report
It may also be about making money. Borrow familiar imagery to connect with consumers/audience.Report
… never played a japanese puzzle game, I take it?
Seriously, it’s been my general impression that Japanese media, as American media, doesn’t make much for overseas audiences. Heroes is about the only American show that seemed like it paid any attention to overseas audiences (and without understanding Japanese, you were Lost!)Report
But the JRPG does so poorly outside of Japan.
And if you look at the genre’s two most popular franchises in Japan, Final Fantasy, and Dragon Quest, both certainly mix elements, but still seem to come down strongly on the Anglo-Saxon side of the equation.
Even Link started with a cross on his shield.
It could be the international appeal, Japan doesn’t have the biggest domestic market. Maybe something to do with WWII as well?Report
The market argument is a strong one. For the large majority of the video game era, the places with the most money and leisure time were the United States, Canada, Europe, and Japan. One of these things is not like the others!Report
Dynasty Heroes (and Samurai Heroes) does fairly well, all things considered…Report
Lu Bu!!Report
why, with such a rich mythological heritage of their own, do developers of Japanese fantasy games draw so heavily from Eurpean mythology?
A) Japanese developers, rightly or wrongly, might believe that a Euro-esque game would be more marketable.
B) Because there is appeal in exploring in another culture and mythology. I imagine there are Japanese writers and artists that are as bored with the stereotypical tropes of their cultural fantasies as American, British, and Canadian writers are with theirs.
And Kimmi is right, of course. There are many games that embrace traditional Japanese mythology.Report
See under Erik’s comment for my response to A.
As far as B I agree.Report
I have some thoughts about this question related to some larger points about fantasy in video games. Methinks Erik can expect a guest post submission from me in the near future.Report
damn dope smoking libertarians with their “high” fantasy. why can’t you be real ‘muricans and just get drunk?Report
For some years, I studied C.S. Lewis at the Wade Collection in Wheaton College and the J.R.R Tolkien papers at Marquette University. If High Fantasy is not Christian, the Christians have taken their own fantasy authors to their bosoms.
My first course at Wheaton was Modern Mythology 401, taught by Clyde Kilby of blessed memory, a man who knew Lewis and Tolkien. At the end of the course, I gave him a framed drawing of mine, of Reepicheep the Mouse from the Chronicles of Narnia, holding his little sword aloft. When I gave it to him, on behalf of the class, I quoted Reepicheep “Whether we live or whether we die, let us go on to the end of the world”.
It would be the last course he ever taught. I am told the drawing was on the wall of the room where he died. On the strength of my association with the Wade Collection, I was introduced to Madeline L’Engle. We had a conversation about the Christian-ness of her own fantasy writing. I came away with the belief every fantasy author describes his own private Eden, from which he has been expelled.
As for D.G. Myers, he’s not merely wrong, he’s ignorant. The Talmud and Midrash are chock full of fairy tales. From Sinbad of the Talmud, one of the Aunt Nancy Stories:
“It is a shame,” he said, hotly, “that the impudent ragamuffins of the town should be allowed to cast words of disrespect in the public streets at my sainted master, Rabba bar Chana, the man of profound learning and the famous traveller–“
“Be gentle, good Ali,” interrupted Rabba. “Remember they are little more than babes and have not full understanding. And how can they be respectful when their parents, who should have wisdom and faith, accept not our stories of the many adventures we have had? Yesterday, I told them of the day when our ship had been surrounded by five thousand whales, each a mile long, and they jeered and cried ‘Impossible!'”
“Impossible!” echoed Ali, in a rage. “Was I not there with thee, my master? Did I not count every single whale myself? Who dares to doubt my word? Have I not, for years, been thy faithful guide on thy marvelous journeys? Bah! What know these town fools, whose lives are no wider than the narrow streets in which they dwell, of the wonders of the vast world beyond the seas? Fools, ignorant fools, every one of them, my good master. Why stay you here with them and brook their insults and their sneers? Let us journey forth again this very day. A good ship waits in the harbor.”
Erik hopes fantasy will expand into the fantastical traditions of other cultures. I observe, after many years of studying CSL and JRRT, fantasy has always expanded into other cultures. Iif fantasy has iterated over CSL and JRRT, its authors and readers are content. Literature has moved along without them: authors including – let’s see, looking along my little shelf here in the hotel — Borges, Pynchon, Murakami and John Crowley, manage very nicely. Miyazaki creates marvelous animated movies from the ancient Japanese legends and fairy tales and Disney sells them like hotcakes.
If ever there was a dog returned to his vomit and a fool returned to his folly, it’s the aficionados of the entire Swords ‘n Sorcery genre. Pitiful, untutored wretches: the entire corpus of world mythology lies before them, Borges tried to inform them – they won’t pay any attention. It’s more of the same deus ex machina crap, year after year. Nay, deus ex machina gives them too much credit, let us call it what it is deus ex epistola, the subtle fawning plagiarism of Old Tired Tropes. Gimme that Old Time Religion: it was good enough for Tolkien and it’s good enough for me. It’s high time someone called bullshit on Swords ‘n Sorcery. Erik’s point is well-taken: fantasy has few Christian themes and many pagan ones. The reason why we’re reliant on the old patterns is pretty obvious: it’s a safe sell. But so are all those Harlequin Romances. High Fantasy, indeed.Report
Nicely put, Blaise.Report