A Listicle of Liberal Doom
Writing at The Atlantic, Molly Ball tells liberals to quit being so damned optimistic int he wake of this year’s election. There are four big disappointments in store, she claims, and they are as follows: The possibility of entitlement cuts, the short-term powerlessness of Senator Elizabeth Warren, the weak tea filibuster reform Majority Leader Harry Reid may accept, and the profound unlikelihood of a legislative response to climate change any time soon.
I think she’s off-base on Reid — I simply can’t imagine he’d get the whole conversation of filibuster reform started if he was going to tie himself to a 67-vote threshold, as Ball implies he might — correct on Warren, and right-but-wrong on social insurance cuts and climate. When it comes to the latter, Congress indeed will not act; but as Tim Noah outlines, the president can still do a whole lot of good (or mitigate the bad) on climate change with some of his Executive powers. The EPA can make further rulings on carbon emissions that would be a BFD. When I went to Kentucky a few years ago to study mountaintop removal and its opponents, hopes abounded that Sheila Jackson would issue new carbon limits during the president’s first term. She did; she can do more.
But it’s on entitlements (my preferred phrase is social insurance) where Ball gets the most tangled up. Because although there’s been no shortage of angst on the left in response to Obama’s potential social insurance cuts, what Ball actually describes as being maybe-sorta on the table is — except for one major alteration — the kind of stuff liberals can either stomach or even support:
Obama has talked very tough on tax rates for income over $250,000, but you don’t hear nearly as much strong rhetoric from the White House about progressives’ other ironclad fiscal-cliff demand: protecting Social Security and Medicare. Back in 2011, during Obama and House Speaker John Boehner’s failed attempt at a big deal on the debt ceiling, Obama was theoretically open to the kinds of changes Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell is now advocating, such as raising the eligibility age for Medicare from 65 to 67 and increasing premiums for recipients with higher incomes.
If a fiscal-cliff deal gets made, chances are it’ll include some concessions along those lines. Obama’s opening offer to Republicans included $400 billion in deficit reduction from unspecified changes to entitlements. Suzy Khimm has a helpful rundown of what entitlement changes Democrats have signaled a willingness to consider.
Thus far, defenders of Social Security have been gratified to hear White House Press Secretary Jay Carney say changes to the program are off limits in the negotiations, and even the $400 billion in the president’s offer isn’t too alarming — that savings could come from reducing payments to pharmaceutical companies rather than changing eligibility or benefits, says Jeff Hauser, spokesman for the AFL-CIO, which has been campaigning hard against entitlement-benefit cuts. “Our red lines continue to be clear: December 31 should be the last day of the failed Bush tax cuts for the richest 2 percent, and there is no need for middle-class beneficiaries of Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid to contribute to deficit reduction for a deficit they did nothing to cause,” Hauser said. But while the group would loudly protest any proposed cuts to benefits, he said, “we are open to improvements in the cost-effectiveness of our health-care system.”
If you actually read what Ball wrote, rather than interpret what she wrote through the prism of the click-bait headline (not a criticism; I don’t hate the player instead of the game) you’ll see that the total of things Democrats are considering that the rank-and-file will hate is one — the raise of the Medicare eligibility age. On that score I am not super inclined to be like Jonathan Chait and give DC Dems the go-ahead (see David Dayen for more). But as bad as that idea is, it’s not the kind of major betrayal Ball’s piece would lead you to expect.
Truth is, as long as you’re willing to withstand some trial balloon reports about Dems “considering” various things they quite likely won’t accept, the perilous lame duck session looks likely to end without a Grand Bargain at all.
Don’t forget the War on Drugs!Report
This is an interesting read.Report
Especially in contrast to this.Report
As a FYIGM Libertarian, I’ve mostly been paying attention to Radley Balko.Report
You should read more.Report
Balko: More Coloradans voted for pot than for Obama. No matter.We can’t have something as silly as “the will of the people” undermining the might and authority of the federal government.
Isn’t libertarianism supposed to be a bullwark against the will of the people?
Really, you should read more.Report
Yeah, Libertarians *HATE* the idea of people liking stuff.
Hey… *I* hate the idea of people liking stuff but not intensely or anything… Maybe I should switch parties. Which party do you belong to, assuming, of course, that you hate the will of the people to the point where you’re willing to kill them?Report
Oh, I see that I should just blindly back the party that blindly backed Obama!
Do I get free stuff?
Free stuff is important to me, you see.Report
Maybe you shouldn’t be so defensive and hear the point being made.
If “the will of the people” carries the day for Balko, then he ain’t no libertarian.Report
I assume that he’s a soulless Libertarian without any guiding principles at all who is grasping at the straws of what he assumes people who call themselves “democrats” would favor.
He should read more.
Perhaps assume he’s appealing to “powercrats”.Report
Damn dude. Just because I criticize his rationale doesn’t mean I think he’s soulless. He’s an opportunist, tho. And maybe even a propagandist. But definitely not soulless.
He, like you, has a vision!Report
I suppose we should count ourselves lucky that those in power do not share this vision, lest people be harmed.
Real people, anyway.Report
Ahh. Now you’re fighting straw. At least against me, brother.Report
I may not be arguing against you, brother.
I assure you, there are people who actually hold the position I’m fighting against. It ain’t a strawman, as much as you and I both wish it were.Report
Balko is extremely skilled at emoting outrage and unfathomable moral superiority. He often breaks good stories, too, but you’ve got to cut through all the soap-boxing to see ’em.Report
“Unfathomable”
I think the innocent people he’s helped probably give some amount of depth, despite the fact that he doesn’t share your views on the redistribution of the property of other people.Report
‘Better that 10 guilty men go to jail than 1 unionized government worker takes a pay freeze’Report
Honestly, with the sort of stories he covers, I’d much rather hear outrage expressed than a sort of cool equanimity.Report
I agree with Rufus, even if he does hate me with the power of a million sons.Report
I’ve been thinking about this (well, fever dreaming about it) and I wonder if it isn’t the result of a weird argument similar to Kuznicki’s about charity.
Balko could be helping *SOOOOO* many people with his journalism. He could be arguing for health care, he could be arguing for “social insurance” (is that particular phrasing a signal that means testing isn’t far behind? “You don’t get a check from Allstate if you don’t crash your car, do you?”), he could be arguing for unions, he could be arguing for so very many Federal Government policies…
And, instead, he turns his focus on helping *ONE* guy in Mississippi. He attacks *ONE* crooked medical examiner.
He is the most inefficient journalist ever.
Is that an accurate summation of what’s going on here or is the fever dream lingering into daylight?Report
And The Old Man and the Sea could have been about all fishermen, all whales. Would have at least had some happy endings, ehh?
/literary communism.Report
Or at least about a fisherman that wasn’t a fishing Yankee fan.Report
I would rather the world have more Radley Balko’s than Ed Sullivan’s, Bill O’reilly’s, and Hannity’s.
The drug war and other instances of misbehaving law enforcement and criminal justice need focused attention.
He can hate my economics policies all he wants after that and I’ll still claim him as doing ‘gods’ work.Report
I strongly suspect that the deal on Medicare spending will involve some kind of trigger that kicks the can down the road. I mean, obviously nobody really wants to cut benefits for current seniors, so the cuts will involve future seniors, one way or the other. But I think Obama can say to the Republicans that he recognizes that if Medicare continues to cost more and more, ot will need to be cut. So, he can accept a trigger mechanism that will cut the benefits of future retirees, perhaps by extending the age of entry or other means as well, if and only if Medicare spending goes above X percentage of GDP. The trigger will be different from the R’s preferred plan of changing Medicare now such that future seniors will (trigger or no) have to wait to be 67 to be covered.
A trigger like that allows Republicans to claim victory that they capped spending and were serious about cutting entitlements (to save the entitlements, as they put it, paradoxically).
And it allows Obama to claim victory, too. He can say to the right of the party who agree that damage to entitlements must be done that he is serious about the budget and getting healthcare costs under control. But he he can tell the left of the party that future Congresses (including Republicans who need the votes of the elderly) are likely to not allow then current (now future) seniors to have their benefits cut, if it can be prevented at all. (This is absolutely true, IMO.)
He can also then argue that medicare is only expensive because we pay too much for healthcare in general and that in order to avoid cuts to medicare and future seniors, we need to strengthen the cost cutting measures in the ACA. This is also, true IMO. The only solution to the long-term problem of medicare costs is to make medicine less expensive, which won’t be done just by cutting medicare, and would be worsened by putting more people on the more expensive, less efficient system of private insurance.Report
Raising the eligibility age just seems…dumb. It can’t possibly save much money (the ‘younger’ years of Medicare are the cheapest), for one.
Secondly, given what people will pay out of pocket for insurance and the difference in rates between private insurance and Medicare, I can see it easily costing the public MORE to insurance these people than is technically saved.
The only people saving money on this would be everyone who dies before being old enough to get Medicare.Report
Rather than up the minimum age, we shold have a cut-off. Sorry, bro, you can’t retire at 65 and live to 95. Then again, I’m on record as planning to cash in my chips by 75.Report
Sorry, bro, you can’t retire at 65 and live to 95.
This is a very important question I’m about to ask: Why not?Report
Well, if an person can afford it thru their own funds…
But if you (jaybird) are paying for it? Hasn’t one of your arguments all along been that entitlements can’t be open ended because resources are scarce and desires are infinite?Report
Oh, I already know that I’m an evil “fuck you, I’ve got mine” libertarian.
I’m just wondering why liberals might suddenly start screaming “FUCK YOU, I’VE GOT MINE!” at sixty-five year olds.
Perhaps there’s common ground between us!Report
It’s the 95-year-olds, and I’m screaming because I’m done paying for their fishing hearing aid batteriesReport
Let us legalize pot and subsidize DVD players and box sets of television shows.
As the elderly watch The Waltons (stoned) or All in the Family (stoned), we can be pleased that we are spending less on their health care than if they were demanding to play golf or do arts and crafts with the church group.
If you index “quality of life” to “happiness”, their quality of life will hit the damned roof.Report
According to this it could have other benefits for them as well.Report
Kick it up to Quantum Leap, then.
Damn. Now I’m sitting here all envious.Report
That’s after speeding it up when they’re younger.
It just flattens out the whole damned process.Report
Aren’t we just looking to smooth the whole ride out, so we can just slide right in to the grave?
Reminds me of a Dave Barry (I think) line about how people who run for exercise are basically just preparing themselves for elderly joint aches and pains early.Report
With elderly Liberals, the phrase goes “I’ve got mine, you’re fucked.”Report
Gott danged! There are some winning turns of phrase in this thread.Report
For once I get Jaybird’s approach. And I’m not sure if others don’t or they’re just loathe to answer the question.Report
JB,
Here’s why… Call this an unfair generalization if you must, but old people are no good at everything.Report
No. Just no.Report
They’re buzzsaws at stuff like Gin Rummy, dude. Like, don’t play “penny a point” unless you brought a couple hundred bucks.
Seriously.Report
Is no one getting the reference!?!?!?!?Report
I get it, but I think Mo said “old people are no good at nothing.”Report
Yes! Perhaps we should not let people retire until they have only ten years left to live.Report
Where is Hugo Pinero when we need him?Report
This is correct–raising the eligibility age is basically the worst way to cut Medicare benefits (here are numbers).Report
Raising the age to collect Medicare is particularly unfair (liberal baseline measurement, isn’t it?) to those who actually do physical labor.
Fisherman, farmers, loggers, mill wrights, mechanics, housekeepers, waiters, cooks; the list goes on and on. They use their bodies, and use them hard. Asking them to work longer, to do more wear and tear?
Better, I suspect, to develop a means-tested formula the creates a curve for cost sharing. But the same goes for social security, I think.
And the conversation more crucial to have is the death panels talk; what’s really reasonable to do to extend lives in those last few months? I suspect many people do not realize how barbaric some of our practices are, now. And as a society, I find we’re really ill equipped for those conversations.Report
Maybe we should have people’s kids take care of them instead. Didn’t I read somewhere that the birth rate was down in the U.S. Might make it an incentive to have more kids. Plus, maybe then parents would take more of an interest in how their kids turn out…..the more money the kids make the better retirement mom and pop will have.Report
Really?
“The Congressional Budget Office has estimated that if the Medicare eligibility age was increased from 65 to 67, the federal government would save $124.8 billion between 2014 and 2021.”
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/11/obama-medicare-eligibility-age_n_894833.html
I guess that isn’t that much or you just don’t have any idea what you are talking about.Report
17 billion a year is rather small. Compare it to the money we spent on the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.Report
It would save 17 billion a year out of a budget of over a trillion dollars, and by “savings” I mean “The 65-67 year old set would pay twice as much or more out of pocket”.
So it doesn’t save money so much as it levies a very, very large tax on the 65-67 set which is then called “savings”.
I realize this may be difficult for you to understand, but the cheapest people covered by Medicare are the YOUNGEST people. Which means that cutting out the 65-67 set is cutting out the cheapest people Medicare insures, which saves the government very little money.
Those people then have to actually get insurance on their own, which costs them a LOT more than it does Medicare. In the end, you’ve replaced a cheap method of providing health care with a far more expensive one, and somehow this is a ‘savings’.Report
It’s always a savings when someone else is paying for it.Report
Except that in our system, we all end up paying for it anyway.Report
A couple of random thoughts…
Expect businesses that offer a health insurance benefit to scream. Essentially all such plans currently require employees to sign up for Medicare the instant they turn 65, and Medicare becomes the primary insurer. If the eligibility age is raised, those high-cost employees will continue to get primary coverage from the company instead. All other things being equal, this would drive premiums for the employer higher as some employees who might otherwise retire hang on for another year or two to maintain access to group coverage.
All things are no longer equal. Beginning in 2014, and assuming the eligibility age has been raised to 67, a 65-year-old without employer coverage will be eligible to buy guaranteed-issue community-rated insurance on her state’s exchange, with premiums capped (IIRC) at a single-digit percentage of household income. How that compares to the individual’s Medicare share will depend on a variety of things. What the employer has to pay if they don’t offer an insurance plan compared to the cost of premiums with more older workers on the payroll will also depend. I would anticipate an acceleration of the trend of employers discontinuing a health insurance benefit.
It’s a complicated situation. Which is why I oppose any changes to Medicare that are being decided over the course of a few days without an opportunity for the experts to put some numbers on the possibilities. Yeah, we probably need to make changes in Medicare. But let’s take some time to work through the consequences before we decide on what those changes should be.Report
That photo. Tears ready to break out, “MOM, Barry’s touching me again.”Report
Strangely missing from either Molly Ball’s or Timothy Noah’s lists is any mention of foreign policy at all; for instance, the possibility of approx 10K troops in Afghanistan after 2014 and more illegal wars a la Libya – both agenda items wholly within President Obama’s grasp.Report
I believe the argument is “there’s an election coming up in 2014, it’s not like the Republicans can be trusted to be any better, don’t give aid and comfort to the other side”.Report
Her list is supposed to be a comprehensive (?) list of things Democrats ought to feel great disappointment about. I take it the purpose of the article is to show that both sides feel bad about the recent election – and maybe both sides ought to feel equally bad. I don’t know about that for sure, but that’s the vibe I got.
But I think you’re wrong to assume Democrats will (or even ought to) feel bad about the continuation of certain aspects of our foreign policy. I think most democrats are very pleased with the draw down in Iraq, and very pleased there aren’t more ground troops in Afghanistan even as we continue to fight the WoT. In other words, a continuation of current policy without substantial change isn’t something Democrats will feel bad about. And drone strikes, “kill lists”, etc. aren’t really on the radar.Report
I thought Ms. Ball’s list was about Progressives and ‘the left riding high’? I grant you that Democrats like the warfare state well enough. (and I stand corrected, Mr. Noah’s list is about cheering *Obama’s Agenda*, and the unitary & powerful executive, not necessarily a Progressive or Liberal (or humanitarian) agenda).Report
So, when people’s health is endangered or some even die because the eligibility age for Medicare is increased, that isn’t a major betrayal? I remember when Democrats actually thought protecting Medicare and Social Security was an existential issue that defined them as Democrats. I guess those days are over.Report
Medicare is a bloated program that needs to be wound down and reformed if it is to be sustainable in the long term. It irks me when conservatives who ae supposed to be for reducing entitlements try to demagogue it for political purposes when democrats actually try do what conservatives say must be done. But that is expected. Politicians are wont to do stuff like that. That is the nature of the beast. When conservatives who have no need to demagogue it repeat the same message it makes me wonder whether they are stupid or evil.Report
Yet Medicare is cheaper per-person than private insurance. And the ACA was chock full of things designed to drop costs, including the costs of Medicare.
I’m not sure what sort of ‘reform’ you have in mind for Medicare — any comparison of it’s costs and cost growths compared to private insurance, and Medicare comes off looking darn rosy.
Except for the Prescription Drug bit — and you don’t need to ‘wind down’ a program to give it the authority to bargain for group discounts.Report
outlines, the president can still do a whole lot of good (or mitigate the bad) on climate change with some of his Executive powers
Will it create a firestorm if I say that the cavalier assumption that presidents ought to act in the absence of legislative agreement bothers me?Report
99% of things written about national politics fall into this trap. I really wish I were a guest on Sunday Talk shows just so every time it was my turn to speak, I could sit there and reprimand everyone for failing to understand the proper/actual role of Congress/President.Report
It is not a question of whether Elizabeth Warren will become a progressive savior, but a question of when.Report
One thing you can count on: politicians kicking the can down the road and the maintenance of the status quo, much to the detriment of the country’s future. Nothing with get solved. Any the debt is still rising. Cuts in the amount of planned increases are not cuts. The amounts to be cut via the cliff per year are negligible. Smoke and mirrors.
The only way you’re going to get anywhere near substantial cuts are cuts in entitlements, and yes, that means SS and Medicare. Not going to happen.Report
Amazing how this could have been from today and it is still fully relevant. The “facts” liberals think they own. So relevant still!Report