The Intersection of Midsize Sedan and Crossover SUV

Will Truman

Will Truman is the Editor-in-Chief of Ordinary Times. He is also on Twitter.

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26 Responses

  1. Damon says:

    Another thing that’s gone mostly. Manual transmissions. You used to save a grand or so getting a manual vs automatic transmissions. No, most vehicles aren’t even offered in a manual. Why? Automatics give slightly higher fuel economy in gov’t tests and it increased the manufacturers fleet average. Notice that this change was NOT consumer driven.Report

    • Philip H in reply to Damon says:

      Here here. I so miss my stick shifts. I once beat a mid 80’s corvette off the line at a stop light in my dad’s 1967 Volvo Amazon by quietly playing the clutch while we waited for the light to change. He smoked me on the straight of course . . . . .Report

    • Greg In Ak in reply to Damon says:

      People are buying far fewer sticks. It is at least in part consumer driven. They barely even make sticks for sports cars. They sure would if lots of people were buying them.Report

    • North in reply to Damon says:

      The steady march of obsolescence of stick shifts in luxury, sports and other high end cars falsifies your core allegation. Manual transmission isn’t vanishing because the gummint took your stick shifts- it’s vanishing because most people can’t be bothered to learn stick, which makes stick niche, which makes less people bother to learn stick, which makes stick even more niche, and economies of scale take over.

      Same as how self driving cars, should they ever be perfected, will swiftly obliterate manual cars from the market with gummint nary lifting a finger.Report

      • Damon in reply to North says:

        Yes, there is a consumer choice element in this. But there’s also manufacturer decisions. Air condition used to be optional too, and power windows, etc. How many vehicles you see now like that? Why? part being no demand, part being the manufacturer wants to sell cares that “fully loaded”. And a lot of manufacturer “choices” are heavily influenced by various gov’t regulations, i.e. CAFE standards, crash impact, etc. It’s getting hard to buy a car that does NOT have all that new safety crap: lane departure, crash avoidance, etc. Since automatics give a higher average fuel efficiency, especially after you tweak the gears, it incentivizes the manufacture to build fewer manuals.

        Ever notice that it’s very hard to get an eight-cylinder car? Even a six cylinder is much rarer today that it was a decade ago. Why? CAFE standards. Hell, BWM doesn’t even offer a 6 cylinder in the 3 series except for the M340i They did when I bought my 330i in @ 2010-it came standard.
        You have to go up to the 5 series for one to be found standard, unless you go for the M upgrades. Do you really think that BMWs offerings are SOLEY driven by consumer choice?Report

        • Michael Cain in reply to Damon says:

          Also, reducing choices reduces manufacturing costs. 30 or so years ago, Honda decided that the interior color on all their cars would be gray, with cloth seats. Those were the days when Detroit sold a variety of interior colors and both vinyl (cheap) or cloth (expensive) upholstery. I remember reading an industrial engineering piece about Honda’s savings. One part was a million cloth seats, all gray, were cheaper than a million vinyl seats in multiple colors. Another was several little process savings since it was no longer possible to mismatch interior trim components.Report

        • North in reply to Damon says:

          I would never dream of saying government has no influence over such things but the idea that the departure of stick shift from the market is largely or even majorly government driven strikes me as ludicrous.

          My understanding is that power windows are enormously easier for manufacturers to make, install and manage that manual ones though I’m open to being corrected on that. It’s beyond me how a CAFE standard would eliminate manual windows.Report

  2. InMD says:

    We entered our marriage with 2 small SUVs (a Ford Escape and a VW Tiguan). After a child and the vehicles becoming essentially family property we realized this made no sense. The VW was far roomier for passengers but the storage was laughable. The Escape had notably better cargo capacity but it was legitimately not comfortable for adults in the backseat. Of the two the Escape got considerably better mileage due to having ecoboost.

    Once both were paid off we decided it would be better to have a legit larger SUV with some real capacity, mileage be damned, and a smaller more efficient car for local driving around (work from home of course helped this decision). For the small/efficient we got a hybrid Camry. Which gets me to the point- it is not meaningfully smaller than the Escape. The mileage of course isn’t apples to apples since one is a hybrid but the Camry is actually longer and has a lot more room in the backseat. The trunk is smaller but isn’t small. So all of this is to say I agree- treating these vehicles as different types since one is an ‘SUV’ and one a sedan really makes no sense. They’re competing for the same market space.Report

    • Will Truman in reply to InMD says:

      I really think this is the way to go. It is helpful to have a household to have one good cargo vehicle, but the next one need not be and there are advantages to have a good-mileage commuter car depending on the commute.Report

  3. Kazzy says:

    Is there data on the risk posed by the SUVs to pets/kids?Report

  4. Greg In Ak says:

    I have suburu crosstrek. It’s a car. A bit higher off the ground and more space are good for me but it’s still just a car. Which is fine.Report

  5. DavidTC says:

    At some point, there isn’t really a difference between smaller SUV and hatchbacks. The smaller SUVs really have managed to reduce their gas mileage.

    I’ve had a hatchback for years now, although admittedly I don’t have to worry about hauling a lot of things…but the few occassions I have had to, they have fit just fine. I think the main difference is that the hatchback is really maneuverable with a smaller turning radius, and the SUV might have 10% more space and is higher up. (Which is something I really dislike, but that’s just me.)Report

  6. Marchmaine says:

    The answer to all is my Honda Ridgeline…

    Seats 5, ok milage, trunk *and* pick-up bed *and* roof rack, rides high, menace to children and small animals – but not as much as full-size truck – and drives like a car from 1987.Report

  7. Philip H says:

    The labeling of all these things has always amused me. We had a Mazda 5 for years – seats 6, great cargo space with the third row folded down, good gas mileage and about as high and long and my wife’s current Subaru Outback. yet in the auto parts world that vehicle is a truck.Report

    • Dark Matter in reply to Philip H says:

      Trucks are popular because they’re big, and because of that, everything needs to be a truck.

      Buying a car is always an adventure because only about one lot out of three has a car that will fit me. So I can assure you, not all cars are large.Report

  8. Michael Cain says:

    Sometime in the next few years I’ll be swapping our old Honda Fit (14 years) and older Honda Odyssey (23 years) plus a pile of cash for an electric crossover of some sort and 240V charger in the garage. By 2028 or so the electricity that charges it will be darned close to carbon-free. With any luck the charger and car will be capable of doing time-shifting during the summer so I can use middle-of-the-night 8-cent-per-kWh electricity to run the A/C during the hotter afternoons (when the utility wants 23 cents).Report