32 thoughts on “12 Rules For Holding Publishing Meetings About Jordan Peterson

  1. Just another example of woke left snowflakes trying to censor anyone who they feel offended by.
    My friends and all like his lectures and talks.Report

        1. As I read this, my mind went to some of the endless negotiations my sons often attempt to engage me in. Eventually, I reach a point where my response is: “I’ve heard what you said. Your points are valid. But… no. And now we’re moving on.”

          I think it is good that the company made space for their employees to voice their concerns. I hope they listened with open ears and were willing to reconsider their position. If not, then they probably shouldn’t have held the town hall. I find few things more insulting than being told I’m being listened to when, in fact, I’m not.
          A problem emerges when people mistake being heard/listened to with having their priorities adopted by others. I can hear and listen to you without agreeing with you. That CAN happen.
          And the employees aren’t powerless. They can speak their mind and, if rebuffed, they can walk. I realize that may sound callous but we all have to make choices where we decide between competing interests.
          And, at the end of the day, the boss makes the call. That can feel sucky if you ain’t the boss. And if you can’t deal with that suckiness, welp, become the boss.

          This is completely independent of who Jordan Peterson is (I don’t know) or what he has/will write (I also don’t know).Report

          1. I wonder if there have been instances of employees complaining about a publisher deciding not to publish a book? How are they handled, and do the publishers ever listen?Report

            1. I wouldn’t know.

              I guess I’m a little old-man-crotetchy right now, shaking my fist at underlings who seem confused when their bosses don’t take every cue from them.Report

          2. I’ve read *SOME* Jordan Peterson.

            It’s one of those things where the good things that he says were said better by others (Have you read Marcus Aurelius? Read Marcus Aurelius) and the bad/dumb stuff that he says is bad/dumb but it’s not outside of tolerance for established self-help parameters.

            He has a number of followers who were/are disaffected males and you know what guys are like when they’re disaffected.

            So that backwashed onto Peterson.

            Anyway, I think that JP wasn’t that bad, all things considered. Not the best you could read but if someone didn’t have decent parents, I could see someone reading JP and figuring some stuff out that they wouldn’t have figured out without him. I mean, if they’d had as much privilege as I have had, they’d know to read Marcus Aurelius instead.

            But they didn’t. They ended up with Jordan Peterson.Report

            1. JP is sure he is brilliant and has insight into everything based on his expertise in a disregarded backwater of modern psychology. The uses of Jung aside, which might have some story telling value, he has no clue how clueless he is about everything else. But as some basic self help he seems okay at that.Report

              1. Eh. It’s like finding out that someone’s favorite movie is Love, Actually or something.

                I could see why someone might be inspired to put together a powerpoint on how toxic Love, Actually is, discuss the various pathologies of people who watched Love, Actually a second time, and so on but, at the end of the day, it’s a dumb movie and while I could probably recommend a dozen movies in the same genre that are better without having to resort to Google to do so, I can’t help but notice a weirdness start to creep in when someone starts talking about the people who want to watch Love, Actually 2: Love Actuallyer and starts talking about how much they hate those people and then starts to cry.Report

              2. That’s a hilarious example.
                My wife loves Love, Actually and watches it every Christmas season. One of our first arguments as a couple was when she made the mistake of putting it on at my old apartment after my roommate and I had been drinking all day watching football. Suffice to say it was not the right time for a RomCom and definitely not that RomCom. Obviously we got passed it, though to this day I am banned from the room any time she wants to watch one of her girl shows. It isn’t necessary anymore but I fully appreciate and respect the ongoing precaution.

                One of the things I wish we could accept as a culture is that the type of media a person consumes says very little about them. Maybe not nothing, but certainly not so much that we should feel comfortable drawing all kinds of far reaching conclusions based on something on their book shelf or Netflix history or whatever else.Report

              3. Heh, yeah. My wife loves Hallmark channel mystery shows. There are a gaggle of them all sort of like murder she wrote. A cutesy title about a baker or seamstress who solves murders all very genteel and pretty. Also likes all the NCIS/CSI shows but she isn’t, as far as i know, a murderer nor does she like violence. Again as far as i know. People like what they like for all sorts of reasons.Report

              4. While I don’t actually like the Hallmark mystery shows, I respect them as a matter of craft and enjoy deconstructing them as I watch. The formula is right up front and very well executed. I have always thought it would be fun to swap out the perky female leads once a year and plug them into each others’ shows to see if anyone would notice the difference.
                But anyone who has been anywhere near a homicide knows how stressful it is for civilians. It’s tough enough on cops, but how do these bakers, bookstore owners, and librarians manage to get deeply involved in several murders a year without deep psychological trauma. So what I really want to see is a new series called Murder Magnet, in which a shrink deals with women who have been swept up in repeated murder investigations and are having a hard time of it. I even picture the first scene of the premier episode: a few perky Hallmark mystery heroines are waiting in an office, the inner door opens and out comes Angela Lansbury, politely thanking the main character doctor and leaving, while the other patients are amazed.Report

              5. (I can’t help it…) Former Marine here. The last book I read (just finished): “Rebecca” by du Maurier. The last thing I watched (just last night for maybe the 12th time): The “Prom” episode from “Buffy.” Fight me.Report

        2. The problem is there is a vast difference between the claims of offence i.e. “icon of hate speech and… white supremacy” and the reality.

          The claim basically is “I disagree with you (or maybe even dislike you) ergo you’re engaging in hate speech and should be unable to talk”.Report

  2. Peterson’s not a white supremacist, at all. He’s a Jungian, so I think he’s got some really fundamental things wrong, but I wouldn’t be in tears if my publishing house printed his book. If you’re making false statements to discourage a publisher from printing someone’s ideas, well, why are you in the business?Report

    1. I really don’t get the crying, emotional meltdown stuff over… a book. That kind of reaction says more about the person having it than the author. It really makes me wonder where these people come from, and how they manage to make it out the front door every day without an emotional breakdown.Report

            1. It was real at Google in the widely mischaracterized l’affaire Damore, and it was real at the NYT when they threw Bennet out over the Tom Cotton editorial. Inmates are running lots of asylums these days.

              I’ve never really bought in to the “employers have all the power” myth, but this makes it even harder to believe.Report

  3. I mean, about 90% of the guy’s schtick is “he makes the liberal snowflakes CRY!!” so, you know, maybe, if you’re opposed to him, then don’t write the marketing for his next self-help book for free.Report

    1. My take was that the JP people should start saying that “This Did Not Happen” and that it’s an exaggeration, there was one person who complained in the breakroom.

      AND THEN GET THE PARTICIPANTS TO SCREAM INTO THE CAMERA ABOUT HOW AWFUL IT WAS AND HOW MANY PEOPLE WERE REALLY CRYING FOR REALReport

  4. Employees who object to a course of action taken by their employer, which they cannot abide, should quit. It’s very liberating.Report

  5. You only need one rule about holding publishing meetings about Jordan Peterson.

    Don’t publish things written by Jordan Peterson.

    So many problems avoided that way. There are other ways to make money.Report

  6. Jordan Peterson is a good communicator of broad self-help messages to young men that produced something of a cult of personality and a grifting empire. He’s also something of a kook and managed to get addicted to drugs then went to Russia to do a treatment for drug addiction that Western hospitals considered too dangerous compared to the potential positive outcome to try. He also has views on gender that the transgendered community find broadly offensive.

    His defamation lawsuits and coziness with people like Viktor Orban suggest he’s no free speech hero either, but likes to posture as such for perceived victimhood status.

    All in all, he’s not a man worth getting worked up over and doing so gives him more visiblity than he deserves.

    He’s also from my part of the world originally and went to my university, were he was known for being smart and quite odd. On that basis, I have difficulty summoning much ire in his direction.

    In the words of philosopher Wayne of Letterkenny, you should all just take 20% off of this.Report

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