Shut Up, Boomer!
Please note, this is not a pro- or anti-vaccine article. It’s a cultural observation, not advocacy. If you have comments regarding vaccines in either direction, please walk into the middle of Death Valley and shout them loudly at the sky. And leave your canteen in the car, would you?
Regardless of your position or my position or anyone’s position on vaccines, I strongly believe that Baby Boomers need to shut up about the subject. I’m talking locking their lips with a tiny invisible key, and throwing it off into the distance somewhere, never to be retrieved.
SHUT. UP.
Legally mandated disclaimer: #notallboomers, certainly not YOU, gentle reader, and some of the people I’m calling Boomers are that slightly older group born just before and during WWII some call “The Silent Generation”. I include them here because in most cases, this one very much included, they behave in an even more intolerably Boomery fashion than actual Boomers.
Due to my ongoing work with the Olds, not to mention my proximity to my parental units and their social circles, I encounter a fair number of Baby Boomers on social media. One of their favorite pastimes is posting memes about vaccines. Most of them go a little something like this:
You eat bologna and you don’t know what is in it, but don’t take vaccines? Aren’t you a special kind of stupid? This meme invariably has a picture of a scowling Clint Eastwood or that terrible cartoon character “Maxine” attached to it.
Or: Anyone not getting the vaccine is obviously selfish and doesn’t care if other people die. Let’s prove how much we care about human life by killing them first! (insert really extreme threat to life and livelihood here)
For the more intellectual set: It’s pretty ironic you don’t “trust the science”, when you’re writing this on a computer that gets magic signals from the sky. This meme is invariably posted by someone who doesn’t know how to program that perpetually-flashy clock on their VCR, and also who still uses a VCR.
Now, you may agree or disagree with these sentiments. I don’t CARE. Your opinion about them is irrelevant. The issue is this: posting inflammatory crap for the sake of posting inflammatory crap is not and never has been meant to persuade anyone. These memes are nothing more than a way for a bunch of entitled people who get off on feeling superior to chest bump each other and get a momentary rush over it. They feed an us vs. them mentality, of the sort we have more than enough of in our country already, and that mindset never, ever comes along with us being our best selves. If that isn’t enough of a deterrent, they are actually turning off the very people who are most reluctant to have a jab – younger people.
Folks, these memes are worse than nothing. They actually make people who read them LESS likely to get vaccinated. If you doubt this claim, please read this excellent post by OT alum Erik Kain where he breaks down this fact in great detail. To sum up Erik’s argument, calling people stupid is never convincing. It merely encourages people to feel attacked, to get defensive, to circle the wagons and withdraw into a sort of fortress of solitude where they only listen to those saying what they already believe.
I would add that hypocrites calling people stupid is far more apt to convince them to say “eff you, I won’t do what you tell me” than it is to convince anyone of anything. And when it comes to vaccines, Baby Boomers are the most hypocritical hypocrites who ever hypocrite-ed.
A whole lot of people – even those who support vaccination fully – have noted a stomach-turning insincerity in seeing the generation who firstly, benefits the most from the vaccine by far, and secondly, who has engaged in constant selfishness, health-obsessing, and science-doubting over the course of their lives, lecturing younger generations about their behavior in any of those arenas. Being put down and publicly shamed by Boomer hypocrites has been really off-putting for a number of younger people, who are more likely to be vaccine hesitant on average. Yes, even those who voted Biden – though the issue of vaccine hesitancy has been sadly politicized, this phenom crosses party lines bigly.
While I would like to give you some current numbers on vaccine hesitancy among young people, like so much else having to do with Covid these days, they got that data locked down so tight I couldn’t find what I considered reliable numbers in a reasonable Google search. Suffice to say, it’s the prevailing wisdom – people under 40 have been more reticent to get the vax than older people, and I’m fairly sure you clever folks have all read the same articles I did proving it a few months back, in those halcyon days when you could still find actual data in the news rather than terrifying anecdotes. Beyond what I’ve read about the mindset of hypothetical strangers, I have heard much vaccine hesitancy from my fertility clients and among my adult sons’ friends/coworkers, so I can personally attest that this is a Legit Thing amongst some in the 20-40 age group.
When I mull over their concerns with a drop of empathy in my heart, I kinda see where they are coming from. They look at the science – and indeed, this is REAL SCIENCE, not Fantasy Island stuff – and see that they are at much, much lower risk of dying from the coronavirus. They look at the science – bona fide science! – and see an average age of death from Covid-19 that is higher than the average human lifespan, meaning that the average person who dies of the coronavirus has already lived a full life by any measure. They see a vaccine that has been inarguably rushed into use when other vaccines and other medications took decades to approve – a bureaucratic process that legitimate science repeatedly told us was done for our safety – even when people died from a lack of approval of a medication that could have saved their lives, we were told it was for the public good. They see potential fudging of the numbers and moving of the goalposts done during the studies, studies done by profit-seeking corporations that have gotten in trouble for rushing unsafe drugs to the market before. (This is long, so if you’re pressed for time, skip to the third part of this piece, where the scientific magic happens.)
And let’s not forget that we were also told by experts, repeatedly told by EXPERTS! – that rushing vaccines to the public was dangerous…when it was done by Donald Trump.
Young people are not memory-less idiots and they don’t exist in a news-free vacuum. They see these facts – again, all of them based in actual science and not Dr. Mercola woo – and conclude, “Well, maybe I’ll just hold off a bit here. Just to see.” All things considered, being concerned about one’s health in the Time-of-Covid is not an irrational or unscientific decision, even if you personally don’t share the same concerns. If this decision seems cavalier or foolhardy to you, please remember that young people, by definition, have their whole lives ahead of them. If a vaccine might have some heretofore undiscovered side effect (and again, legitimate scientific research has indicated that the vaccine has already had some very widespread side effects that were not expected or predicted, that were first disbelieved and are only just now being studied), waiting a few months or even a few years, if you are at very low risk from the disease itself, makes a fair bit of sense. This is particularly true if you have fifty more years of life to look forward to and you don’t want to have that screwed up in the name of “SCIENCE” (™) 1
Now, hang all that in the greater context where there’s a pretty fair case to be made that precious precious science, alleged purveyor of all that is good and holy, brewed the Rona up in a lab to begin with, with the funding, support, and involvement of several of the people who were later tasked with investigating its origins and managing our response. Let’s not forget that these allegedly trustworthy-Honest-as-Abe-Lincoln scientists proceeded to mislead and obfuscate for over a year before the evidence became too overwhelming to continue to deny. “No, come on, seriously guys, it was the WET MARKET, we promise, a pangolin, whatever that is, or something, u know those KARAZY CHINAMEN and their bizarre eating habits, what a bunch of gross freaks they are, and there is absolutely nothing racist about this theory of ours either BTW, now get your ass over to Chinatown and hug a Chinese person today because actually it is you, Sir and/or Ma’am, who are the racist!”
Science deniers? More like scientIST deniers, amirite? And some of the very people we were told to trust unquestioningly have been subsequently revealed to be balls deep, or at least wallet-deep, in Wuhan, years prior to the pandemic. Can you blame these kids for having some concerns, all things considered? I mean, expecting Zoomers and Millennials to blindly “trust scientists” when Dr. Fauci himself has lied more than Shaggy after Honey caught him red handed just seems freaking ridiculous to me.
But this isn’t an article about vaccines or why some people are reticent about getting them. Others have already done that, and far better than I ever could. (you can scroll through the first part of this article unless you’re interested in Scott Alexander’s analysis on Ivermectin; the meat is at the end.)
No, this is an article about Baby Boomers and why they’re really just the Literal Worst.
Baby Boomers, whether you love em or you hate em (JK, no one loves them, and this is ok because they have more self-love than all other generations that have ever existed on Planet Earth combined), were blessed with the most wonderful stroke of good luck at birth, emerging into the world in a time and place where technological advances and economic prosperity met at a bar, dropped acid, and reenacted the Kama Sutra – without protection, because it was the Sexual Revolution and AIDS hadn’t gone viral yet. Then the rest of us had the shit luck that their generation was so much bigger than the rest of us that they not only burned through the available resources in terms of jobs and opportunities for achievement in pretty much every arena, but was massive enough to act as a force unto itself, dominating both politically and culturally so much so that here in 2021 we are all groaning “Jesus Christ, enough with the Kennedys already.”
Not only did the Boomers enjoy their beautiful free-range upbringings of the 50s, they had the luxury of rebelling against them, wallowing like swine in 60s drug culture and the sexual revolution without enduring the terrifying and intellectually insulting “just say no” scare tactics of the 80s and 90s. And since enjoying their youths wasn’t enough, entire classes of medications were invented just so they could keep having sex into their dotage, for our precious Boomers must be denied nothing, not even oddly tumescent old man boners.
That subsequent generations are milling around like Oliver Twist, our bellies and our bank accounts empty, unmarried, childless, having no sex at all, hoping for a refill on our porridge bowls or possibly a chance at home ownership, matters not to those who are accustomed to gorging themselves sick on society’s trough and thinking of it as their basic human right. Yet the Boomers have the unmitigated gall to then shake their fists at these so-called slackers for daring to, on occasion, not service their generation’s every need. These fortunate sons and daughters had a smorgasbord of life’s pleasures handed to them on a platter made of some sort of space-age material, devoured it right down to the sprig of parsley, and then began looking around at other generations seeing who they could blame for their raging case of indigestion.
Yes, yes, it’s all that avocado toast those darn Millennials eat, yes, sure, that’s all it is. That’s why your sons and daughters are childless at 37. Avocado-the f*ck-toast. Has nothing to do with their crippling college debt which they undertook only because you told them it was the ONLY way you could adequately impress your friends with your child’s accomplishments…er, I mean, that they could succeed in life. The dire prospects for our nation’s longterm economic wellbeing have nothing whatsoever to do with the fact that the Boomers expanded government massively, screwing over future generations because they were incapable of telling themselves “no” when it came to anything at all, even a military-industrial complex that spends money that doesn’t exist to fund the creation of weapons of mass destruction like, oh, IDK, gain-of-function research into bioweapons. 2
This generation that is, at present, telling their Younglings to “relax, man, and like, trust the science” apparently has forgotten that science also brought to our door nuclear weapons, Agent Orange, thalidomide, leaded gasoline, DES, Phillip Morris pro-smoking “studies”, the Dalkon Shield, antibiotic-resistant bacteria, Vioxx and Celebrex, America’s opioid epidemic, Snackwell’s cookies, the Tuskegee Experiment, and very probably Covid-19 itself.
‘Ppears to me that the Boomers have conveniently forgotten that they themselves have never trusted science, protesting, distrusting, and rejecting things (some of which have saved, or could have saved millions of lives, far more than those taken by the Rona) like pesticides, herbicides, preservatives, nuclear power, GMOs, golden rice, saccharin and its even worse friend the Demon Aspartame, irradiated food, the existence of climate change, and so on.
Boomers distrust science so thoroughly they’ve made a billion dollar industry of herbal supplements, in many cases refusing traditional medicine themselves to swill herbs instead. My Auntie Grizelda, Boomer Extraordinaire, goes on at length about how stupid people are for “going to doctors” instead of “taking St. John’s Wort” and “using CBD oil and pain patches instead of taking painkillers” because “Western Medicine is KILLING PEOPLE” and “BIG PHARMA”. But on Facebook, with her followers cheering her on (the same folks she mocks behind their back for their irritating habit of seeking medical attention for their health issues) she’s all about “trusting the science”.
Another thing that Auntie Grizelda never “trusted the science” on was secondhand smoke, smoking as so many Boomers did all through her pregnancies and throughout her children’s lives, with absolutely no guilt about trapping them in a car with air as blue as the summer sky. She didn’t make them wear their seat belts, either – another fact she appears to have forgotten now that she has social media, regularly posting memes comparing vaccines to seat belt use. Auntie Grizelda, just like her peers, thought nothing of demanding antibiotics for every case of the sniffles, forgetting to use half of them, but then kept them in the fridge, expired, for the next case of the sniffles that came along. She proudly fed her children raw cookie dough and unwashed fruit and would get furious at anyone who didn’t want to feed their own child a bloody pink hamburger – even AFTER the e.coli outbreak that killed several children.
Her obliviousness to danger even extended beyond her own family; she happily sent her children to school sick constantly because “germs are good for people,” even sending them to birthday parties and CampFire meetings with active fevers, gushing snotnoses, and hacking coughs. She allowed one of her children to go to an end-of-school festival with a very mild case of chicken pox – one of the most contagious diseases there is. I don’t recall her ever worrying that an old person or an individual with a compromised immune system might be negatively affected by her decisions then. In fact, she would roll her eyes at anyone who stayed home from work or school when they were sick, those lazy pussies.
Lest you think I am exaggerating re her cavalier attitude towards the safety and suffering of others, in our most recent phone conversation, she declared (in light of Bob Dole’s passing) that they should have had a war to teach young people respect, like the way Bob Dole had to learn respect. You know, by nearly dying while somewhere between 70-85 million other people were killed, and into the billions of others suffered deprivation, physical infirmity, and great sorrow. (I know what you’re thinking, but she is super liberal and a Buttigieg supporter. This is a cross-political, generationally-based mindset.)
You know the Boomers I’m talking about. We’re all very well acquainted with them and their tendency to decry younger generations as overly delicate helicopter-parenting germaphobes because we cut our children’s hot dogs into tidbits to prevent choking. It’s different this time, though, because, you know, it’s THEIR safety at risk. Rearrange your life, folks, top to bottom, stem to stern, no risk is too great for YOU (you, not them) to incur when a beloved Boomer – our nation’s GREATEST TREASURE – is in peril!
Ah, Boomers, you are truly the worst. The rules for thee, but not for me. Even when it comes to the needs of their own children and grandchildren. KIDS, whom non-sociopathic human beings are supposed to always put first, are located well behind that Boomer-a-licious desire to visit all-you-can-eat buffets and waddle their knee replacement-ed, morbidly obese selves back onto cruise ships.
For those of us who don’t suffer from a raging case of generational narcissism, it’s hard to know what to make of this veritable army of elderly people who in their youths gleefully rejected their parents’ values – very much including science – in the name of freedom and self-expression, insisting on their right to live their own lives their own way no matter who it hurt, yet in their dotage expect unquestioned filial responsibility from their own kids, even at the expense of said children’s own well-being.
As for freedom and personal expression and living their lives their own way, well, for Millennials and GenZ, social media must suffice. Sorry kids, it’s all you get. A Boomer somewhere might get SICK! And by the way, get your butts off social media and LIVE, man! What is WRONG with kids these days anyway?
This generation that used to exalt experience, claiming that it was better to die, to DIE than to bend even just the littlest bit to The Man, has had absolutely no compunction about locking up four generations of younger people, most of whom were at very little risk from Covid-19, to save their own wrinkled skins. They’ve had no compunction about tanking the economy (how many times WILL the greed and gluttony of Boomers tank the economy, anyway?? Isn’t this like the 5th or 6th time we’ve been down this road?) all to extend their magnificent, glorious lives a little longer, because they really needed to listen to that Best of Rod Stewart Album while visiting Joshua Tree one last time. It was on their Bucket List, and God forbid a Boomer should have to miss a single solitary thing on their Bucket List.
And now that it’s time to go back to work, slaving away for those ungrateful Baby Boomers who overwhelmingly own most businesses – by a factor of ten times the rate at which Millennials do – that the young people have the temerity to say “nope, not this time, not for those wages, and not for that kind of treatment” well surprise, surprise, they don’t like that either.
Helpful hint: If you have spent a relatively long human lifespan thinking that everyone you encounter, the older people and the younger people alike, are irredeemably selfish a-holes, the odds are stellar that YOU are, in fact, the selfish a-hole.
Truly, the Boomers are the locusts of generations. They sucked the life out of their poor Greatest Generation parents (what little remained after surviving a Depression and WWII) and then set about sucking the vitality from the generations that followed them. And they’re unbelievably, shamelessly, STILL asking for more, more, more. Over the years the Baby Boomers have proven themselves ready, willing, and able to take endlessly from anyone, everyone, anyplace and everyplace. If there was a way to take candy from a baby by charging it to the humongous national debt that ballooned so horrifyingly on their watch, they’d do it in a heartbeat even knowing that the baby in question will have to pay it off someday.
Do you understand the optics of this for young people?? It isn’t good, guys. Boomers, you’re only getting by with it because the Millennials and the Zoomers are legitimately better people than you are. From my position as a bemused Gen X outsider looking on dispassionately from my seat at the back of the bus, caring about nothing because I’m used to getting screwed over by the Boomers and I learned long ago to save my energy, it’s just about gross to see the generation who claimed it was a violation of their fundamental human rights to have their hair cut, willing to use the power of the law in order to force people to have a medical procedure that some of them just don’t want to prevent a disease they’re not at all vulnerable to.
My Boomer dudes, YOU wouldn’t get your bangs trimmed, but you think it’s ok force healthy youths to wear masks on their face even when outdoors and alone, and even to give up their right to leave their home freely. All because you want to take a cruise and not have to worry that your two, scratch that, three, or are we on four now, IDK hard to keep up with it, vaccines may not hold ya.
Not only is it wrong and selfish and greedy beyond belief, it’s a betrayal of all those beautiful sentiments regarding freedom and self-actualization the Boomers claimed to believe in. And the sign said long haired freaky looking people, need not apply. Let me pause here to wipe the tears from my eyes before they drench my mask! A HAIRCUT, OMGosh how terrible for you!! Jesus, y’all were just so full of shit. Whether one agrees with Covid health policy or not, it’s easy to understand why a good many people find the Boomer position grossly hypocritical.
Obviously this vid is about how Boomers hoarded the vaccine for themselves at first even though they were mostly retired and didn’t even need to go anywhere, but it’s a pretty good summation of the chronically-entitled me-first Boomer attitude.
Why should Boomers have gotten the vaccines first, anyway? Yes, they were at greater risk, but they also had greater resources to live off of, and fewer places to be. Is that even good public policy in a pandemic, to vaccinate people who could stay at home indefinitely FIRST? If our goal was to eradicate the Rona, shouldn’t the vax have gone first to at-risk people who had to, you know, WORK for a living? Who couldn’t sit at home watching cable news all day living off their fat retirement paycheck garnered at a time when Big Business still had loyalty towards their employees (yet another thing Baby Boomers enjoyed and then happily killed off?) You know, those people who had to drag their tired asses out and about every single day to keep the country going, inasmuch as it actually is? The kids who have decades of life awaiting them and not a handful of years, if that even?
No, of course not, because Boomers.
A lot of younger people are just plain fed up with the idea that we should do WHATEVER it takes to allow 85 year olds to be able to go out to lunch and play golf in the six months they have remaining to them before they keel over dead from some other cause. In the meantime the rest of us eat a Cup o Noodle at our desk — that is, if we’re lucky enough to have a job still — and think back fondly on that one time we went to a concert in 2016.
The Boomers don’t care. For all their talk of civic responsibility, they have absolutely none themselves. Zero. In their minds, if it’s not good for them, it’s not good, period.
People – kids, even – are committing suicide. Addicts are relapsing and overdosing. Businesses are going under – it is estimated that 40% of all black-owned businesses will close forever due to the pandemic. Grocery store shelves are emptying. Children’s education, and indeed, their mental health, is suffering. People are dying from postponing medical tests and non-emergency procedures. Vulnerable individuals in poorer countries around the world are STILL WAITING for vaccines and probably will be through 2024, while Boomers in the First World are like “nah actually I’m gonna need three of those bitches, maybe four, just keep em coming why don’t you, and be sure you hit that 22 year old over there, even though he’s at very little risk and doesn’t even want the shot. Why? Because they might accidentally make ME sick, of course, obviously, DUH! I know the chances of anything fatally bad happening to me are slim since I have been vaccinated myself, but you can’t be too careful since I’ve only made it three years past the average human lifespan! I NEED MOAR!”
Ya know, I probably wouldn’t have published this article, just left it on my computer as a satisfying rant, but I went looking for memes thanking young people who have been vaccinated and found NONE. That pretty much sums up Boomers, doesn’t it? Where is our thank you, Boomers? Where? How about some humility and some gratitude for a change, instead of superiority and disdain? How about an ‘atta boy’ for those younger people who have had the vaccine FOR YOUR SAKE instead of telling those who haven’t how moronic they are for not doing exactly what you want them to, quickly enough for your liking?
When will the sacrifices of other generations on their behalf ever be enough for these greedy, ungrateful old jerks?
The answer is never. It will never be enough for them, because they’re the Baby Boomers, the generational equivalent of the Sarlacc Pit. Always hungry, forever digesting. They’ll continue to ask for more until they are denied. That’s how human vampires are. They’ll drain you dry if you don’t tell them it’s enough already, and show them the stake you have ready if they get up in your face about it. If some poor kid in Generation Z wants to deny these Boomer bloodsuckers their pleasure by keeping their shirt sleeve firmly tugged down to their wrist, well, alls I’m saying is that I can understand the impulse. Nobody wants to do anything for someone who has a lifelong history of treating other people like Count Dracula treated Renfield, and displays not a whit of gratitude. “If you don’t do what benefits me, at all costs to yourself, you’re a special kind of stupid.” Hey, yeah, well, screw you, Maxine.
My friends, I’m gonna reveal the harsh reality of Life After Rona here. It’s not something any of us like, but it’s the stone cold truth, and what’s more, it’s science, which you purport to trust. Lean in, inasmuch as social distancing will allow: You can’t eradicate a disease that the vaccine is not working for and that is capable of rapid-fire mutation. That wish that so many Boomers are constantly expressing, that “Covid-19 just go away again and never come back so I can resume my life before I die” is a child’s wish, a fool’s wish, and it has nothing whatsoever to do with science. Trusting in that wish is not trusting in science, it’s trusting in magic. Science isn’t magic, and neither are vaccines.
Smallpox was eradicated because it doesn’t mutate fast and thus responded well to vaccination. SARS-CoV-2 is not smallpox, not even close, and letting it run amok in Third World countries, mutating constantly, while rich Baby Boomers in the wealthy West suck up every available vaccine just in case, is sheer unscientific lunacy. (Case in point, Omicron.)
As for those polio and mumps and measles vaccines you folks remember so fondly from your childhood? They only worked as well as they did because most adults were already immune to the diseases, having had them in childhood, leaving a much smaller pool of people in need of immunity via vaccines.3
By the way, even under these ideal circumstances, it took decades for these diseases to retreat fully. Decades. When I told my Boomer mother-in-law this, she didn’t believe it; I’m telling ya, a not-small percentage of Boomers are operating with a badly skewed, ahistorical, unscientific mindset where they really truly expect that Covid-19 is going to disappear in, like, ten minutes from now or whatever. Face facts folks; the Rona is not going away any time soon, all but certainly not within a Boomer’s lifetime. It’s science. I wish it wasn’t, boy howdy do I ever, but it IS science.
Never in human history have we tried to eradicate a disease that the entire population had no immunity to. NEVER. Expecting this entirely new process to go off without a hitch within a couple of months if only we put a gun to everyone’s head, is a nonsense bullshit expectation. And setting public policy on a nonsense bullshit expectation is not a sound approach to governance.
Science. Who’s denying it again?
Look, we all wanted the vax to work, to work flawlessly and completely and forever and ever (even the handful of true anti-vaxxers, the ghouls who get off on seeing vaccines fail, wanted that, I suspect) and it just ISN’T. People are catching and spreading the disease after having been fully vaccinated. Some people are even still getting real sick and dying fully vaccinated, and that means even if we had 100% compliance, with all the youngs and all the olds joining hands and singing Down With The Sickness, it would still be spreading and still be killing to some extent.
Boomers, you would still have to worry when you’re out there buying tole painted wooden geese and crocheted pot holders at craft fairs that you might be vulnerable. Because you ARE still vulnerable! You’re calling for people who are at very little risk from the disease, to be forcibly vaccinated in the name of achieving an impossible goal. You’re calling for a massive and intrusive violation of civil liberties in the name of maintaining a pretend fantasy in which you can daydream that that big fat meanie pants Covid-19 spoiling all your fun will be gone for good and you can go back to Golden Corral. But I’m afraid it’s here to stay.
Do you feel super awesomely good about that, Boomers? Because I thought you were the quintessential anti-authoritarian rebels. I thought you were brave and principled and stood up for the little guy against the big bads of the world. I guess not.
And to think all it took to get you to give up everything you so constantly, loudly, and obnoxiously claimed to believe in was the threat of a slight reduction in the years of your life. ON AVERAGE. That you can mitigate to a large extent by getting vaccinated yourself, mitigate even more by not being obese, and mitigate pretty much entirely by continuing to quarantine. Yourself. Not demanding that little children and young adults quarantine indefinitely FOR you while you go on that trip to Branson or Napa Valley you always wanted to take. Not demanding that people who are reticent about the vaccines be forced to have them at the point of a gun.
I mean really, that’s pretty weak sauce for a bunch of people who used to bladi-bladi-blah about freedom and civil rights and being willing to die for what you believed in. But as I’ve suspected for a real long time now, you only said those things because it was cool at the time.
It may be you get your way anyway, Boomer buds. Vaccination rates among those under 40 are gradually going up – NOT because those naughty Youngs are finally listening to your elder wisdom, but because the vax has been around long enough so we have a bigger body of observational data to rely upon. Some initially reluctant people are starting to trust the jab more than they did at first. If you believe everyone should be vaccinated regardless of age, you should applaud and thank those people, not belittle them for not acting faster. And Big Daddy Government, the same folks who brought us the draft (remember how you didn’t like the draft, Boomers? Remember how the draft made you disrupt and risk your whole entire life for the sake of rich, arrogant old men you didn’t even know? You may want to think on that…) may very well end up successfully mandating that everyone gets the vaccine.
Once again, the Roulette Wheel of Fate will give the Boomers a disproportionate payout. Take the win with grace, you arrogant a-holes. At the very least, stop gloating by posting your little self-congratulatory, “I’m better than you” memes because you’re only making people resent the vaccines and resent YOU for foisting them onto everyone, regardless of their individual risk level. And a resentful people is an uncooperative people. It is ever so and ever more shall be.
Boomers, we ALL hoped you’d die before you got old, but here we are. Please, for once in your lives, if you really, truly, can’t say thank you, just shut up.
- In the name of fundamental human decency, please stop dunking on that poor girl who didn’t have a vaccine because she was worried about potential effects on fertility, and then died from Covid-19. If you have had your children, the privilege of being able to enjoy that very fundamental human experience easily without fertility treatment – or even with fertility treatment – is not to be taken lightly. A young woman’s concerns in that regard, even if or perhaps especially if they ended in tragedy, should not be mocked by people in a much more privileged position. Punching down is a bad look.
- Peeps, they were doing or planned to do gain-of-function research in MERS, a virus with a 30% death rate – how much more function did they want it to gain, anyway? They planned to release a souped-up version of Covid-19 back into bat populations on skin-penetrating nanoparticles, and no, I am not making that up. And the “they” here is Peter Daszak, the guy the WHO then assigned to investigate the origins of Covid-19. I mean, come on. It’s insanity to sigh impatiently and tell ANYONE to “trust science” on this subject. Science DID THIS and science tried to hide it.
- If you doubt this claim about polio, 70% of children infected with the polio virus had no symptoms, 24% had only a mild cold, and 1-5% get a more severe illness that is not fatal and resolves within two weeks. Only 0.5-1% percent of sufferers have any paralysis at all, and most cases of polio paralysis are mild (not that I’m recommending it, I’m simply trying to point out how it is that I can claim most adults had survived polio back in the day. It is because they did.) The WHO estimates that 20 million people living today are polio survivors and this number was significantly higher in the 40’s and 50’s. The polio virus was so widespread and ubiquitous it is believed that prior to the rise of improved sanitation in early part of the 20th century, most human beings around the world had polio as infants while still protected by antibodies they got via the placenta and mother’s milk. The epidemics of polio we recall from the 1940s and ’50s are believed to have happened because improved sanitation meant children and even adults got the disease later on when it was riskier, instead of at a very young age when the disease was typically mild. Straight from the CDC, haters.
So much to work with here, so little time…
Let’s just go with, Yep, Boomers suck, they really are the ‘Me, me me!’ generation, and they just don’t quit. No, seriously, they don’t. Boomers have made me pine for a global mandatory retirement age (especially in politics, right Nancy and Mitch?).Report
There isn’t a month that goes by that someone in the cohort(s) after the Boomers — of which I am one — doesn’t nag me with, “You’re too talented to be retired. You need to be back at work.”Report
Sometimes I wonder, “Do these people have no outside interests except work?” My husband and I both LONG to be retired because we have so many things other than work we enjoy and never have adequate time to do any of them. :/
In other words, Michael, you’re too talented NOT to be retired!Report
There was a small essay on twitter the other day that asked the question “how come more boomers aren’t using drugs and retiring so that they can use even more drugs?”
And the best answer was “There are old men. There are bold men. There are few old, bold men.”Report
I’m rounding in on 55 and would happily take a step-back from my ‘high-flying’ sales position and give it to a younger kid – if there was any possible way to ‘step-back’ or manage ‘health-care’ or ‘retire’ but realistically there isn’t… so cling we must.
20-yrs ago I’d be a young rep talking to a guy my age now (i.e. a boomer) telling me how he was getting bought-out to retire early and was thrilled about it. There are no ‘buy-outs’ for GenX… they don’t buy out your early retirement when there isn’t a retirement plan.
I don’t have a silver bullet… I suspect Medicare at 55 would change some calculations, it would probably change mine. Corporate work is mostly a pyramid scheme so there aren’t really ‘mentor’ positions or the like… just up or out. In our 50’s we basically become un-reemployable … too expensive to keep, too expensive to hire. So cling we must.Report
Earlier penalty-free withdrawals from the 401k!
Wait. That’s even more depressing.Report
Heh, yeah, I just double checked the latest and it’s still 59.5 for ‘early’ withdrawls without penalties.
But the morbid humor is that it was people with funded retirement plans who made the ‘rational’ business decision that it would be ‘better’ for the company if people self-funded their retirement.
An interesting ‘upper left’ policy proposal might be to regulate employer-match requirements… the average cap seems to be approx $5k – $6k if an employee maximizes his contributions to capture the match. Easy if you make $100k, but for the median $55k the realistic employer match is probably closer to $2.75k — assuming you’re still willing to designate 10% of your income.
If we’re self-funding… could make some laws with 100% matches at LOW income levels tapering to lesser matches for folks who can max out contributions.
I get that we thought it would be cool to offer retirement programs as a ‘perq’ but as the first generation to experience how cool that is? I’d support a better way for my kids.Report
I’d be interested in seeing a cost comparison of 100% employer match (or even employer funding at low levels) for given quintiles versus defined benefit plans. I suspect defined benefit still is more expensive than employers just contributing to a 401K.Report
Yeah, there’s probable some wonky paper out there somewhere.
What I was floored to discover is that the ‘BEST’ possible match is really, really huge:
Employers rarely match 100% of employee contributions. Even if they do, there is a limit mandated by the IRS. For 2020, employees can contribute up to $19,500 to their 401(k) accounts. Employers can contribute up to $37,500 to reach a combined employee/employer total of $57,000. Employees over 50 can add $6,500 in “catch-up contributions” as well. So that would represent the best possible match – an extra $37,500 put toward your retirement.
(I’ve never even heard of this being offered… I assume it’s only for, say, limited partnerships? I’m working under the assumption that S-Corps can only have one 401k matching program? but maybe I’m wrong?).
The same site says that the ‘average’ (this is a policy number that should always look at median, not average) employer contribution is 4%
So… somewhere between $2k per year and $37.5k per year is an employer sweet-spot. Plus, of course, the FICA tax too. I’m not forgetting that.Report
Here’s where I wish I could pick and choose benefits, because I would trade the gold-plated health plan I never use for a max employer 401K match. Probably a break even cost on the employers end, but then I have no idea what the tax implications are for the employer to dump money into my 401K.Report
I’ve worked for companies with really good benefits, and nobody matched more than 10%. Most matched 6 to 8%.
And if you were lucky it was 1:1 all the way to their cap.Report
My mortgage still has $X on it.
I don’t know how to do the math…
But I don’t know which would be better for me in the long run:
1. Taking $X out of my 401k and paying off the mortgage and paying mortgage payments (unless there’s an emergency or something) into my 401k until I’m caught back up.
2. Just making the mortgage payments (and paying a hundred bucks over) for the next Y years.
I deeply, deeply suspect it’s #1.
And, if it is, I’m irritated that it’s not an option.
Heck, even if it’s *CLOSE*, I’m irritated that it’s not an option.Report
I’m not a financial advisor, but I doubt the 401k plan would work… your returns should be greater than your interest rate… if not, have you looked at interest rates lately? Maybe a re-finance at 10- or 15-yr. would pull it forward.
PLUS, there’s a decent chance we’re going to ride an inflation wave for a bit… so you might be making those final payments with walk-about money.Report
We did a refi to a 20 year loan last year (or last spring… it all blurs together) and our rates are something that I would have considered unthinkable back when I first asked Jeeves about mortgage calculators. (Heck, when we first got the house!)
And even with our unthinkable mortgage rate, every month when I look at the receipt, I see that I make more payments against the interest than the principal even with paying an extra hundred bucks every month.
It feels like a grift, I tells ya.Report
Things get weird when you’re talking residential real estate along the Colorado Front Range (where JB lives). Several years ago, but less than a decade, we gave our son his “inheritance” early so he had a reasonable down payment on a small condo, with the goal of stabilizing his monthly housing payment. The last time I talked to him, (a) the monthly rent on his last apartment had more than doubled since he moved out and (b) if he sold his condo for the prices the cold-callers are offering, he could pay off his mortgage with enough left over to pay off the mortgage on his SO’s house. She’s a contract employee for NOAA/NCAR — every time the Republicans threaten to shut down the government, they discuss dealing with the mortgages. Being debt- and rent-free opens up a lot of options.Report
Yeah, the unreasonable enormous growth rate of housing in this market is the only reason why Jay’s theory #1 even begins to make sense. Not that I’m gonna let him. (I actually have a pretty good handle on the numbers. And on the actual value of our house as opposed to the wishful thinking value. Unlike certain parties who are really surprised every time we talk to a financial advisor to hear how great we are doing. Which is.. why he puts me in charge of the finances at the end of the day >.> But we do think about it regularly because the housing market here is just… so… it’s wild.)Report
This is what I was going to say and I’m not even that old yet! I expect to be paying to be a parent at least into my late 50s with nothing to land on after but whatever is in my 401(k). I don’t even think earlier Medicare would be a meaningful release valve.
To get people out early they have to feel like they can land safely with a realistic possibility of living another 20-30 years. One of the fun parts of our economy is that day will never come for the vast majority of people even the relatively affluent.Report
Right, for regular folks who can barely fund their 401k’s it wouldn’t do much… for me? It might be the difference between stepping back vs. using penalized funds to basically pay for health-care premiums – vs. just clinging to the job until they fire me for being old, but not really for being old… that’s illegal.
Plus as JB notes above, it’s not like the govt program allows you to consider other options before 59.5… even if you have enough saved to consider other options.Report
2 Points – There is some evidence that the “Great Resignation” is powered quite a bit by older workers (as in, older Americans are opting to exit the workforce). Couple that with a younger workforce unwilling to accept the offers on the table, and you get the current labor issues.
I was listening to NPR (I wish I could find a link) and it had a discussion around how older elected officials should retire from office, but could still serve as party advisors to younger candidates. There is nothing to suggest that a similar tack wouldn’t have value across industries. That would probably be preferable to the normal route the Lazy B would take of allowing a senior engineer to retire without giving them an opportunity for knowledge transfer, then hiring them back at a contractors rate and putting them back to work (and still not giving them an opportunity for knowledge transfer).
As a matter of fact, the inability of corporations* (and perhaps the public sector as well) to accept the reality that knowledge transfer that did not happen organically over the course of a career will require a charge line in the budget system (probably to the dreaded ‘overhead’) is a big part of why your talent is still desired.
*Which are run by Boomers, for the most part.Report
I’m Gen X. I’m resigned to the fact that, when the Boomers above me are replaced when they finally die, it’ll be Millennials to bring in “fresh new outlooks”.Report
It is our fate to be over-stepped, and we knew it early on, hence our overly strong sense of apathy and fatalism.Report
Well, I’m out of everyone’s way and have no intention of going back to that rat race. I have a whole list of small software projects, and one open-ended social science research project (with a number of applied math modeling sub-questions), to satisfy any urges I feel in those directions.
My children always told their friends, “Yeah, Dad’s cool, but weird.” I anticipate the granddaughters saying the same thing.Report
It is a matter of a population size. There are lots of Boomers (who also have way too large an age range. My parents are Boomers as are people who were born in the late 1950s/early 1960s. My dad was theoretically capable of being drafted into Vietnam. Someone born in 1956 or 1963 was not. These are very different experiences). Gen X is a pretty small group in terms of population size. The Millennials were another baby boom. Gen Z looks like it will be a baby bust.*
*The way this played out for me was college admissions. I was able to punch above my weight for college admissions because there was less competition. If I was born 3 or 4 years later, I would have been drowned out by my cohort. Apparently colleges are freaking out about a demographic cliff in a few years lowering the number of applicants.Report
there will be significantly fewer hs grads over the next 10ish years or so, with birthrates falling for almost all domestic populations (outlier is recent immigrants from central and south america, or at least was in 2015).
a connected issue is the lower expected family contributions (fafsa talk) for these populations, coupled with increased demands for student support, disability/learning disability accommodations, and mental health services in particular.
in short, fewer kids, more needs, increased costs per student hour of instruction, etc etc so if you have a kid trying to go to college in the next five years or so, play hardball with financial aid. treat it like car shopping, where you pit competing groups against each other via their offers. some will play moneyball, some will not, but it’s generally worthwhile to try and work with them overall.Report
This gets interesting when you look at the numbers. There are approximately 65 million Gen Xers alive in the United States right now, compared to 71 million Boomers and 73 million Millennials. Fewer Xers for sure, but not so much as to explain the eclipse.
But a higher percentage of Gen Xers are immigrants, which means that there were more Millennial and Boomer kids than Gen X kids. As I wrote in my comment below, a lot of this is driven by pop culture and pop culture is largely driven by advertising and advertising is driven by demographics.
Pop culture focused on Boomers for far too long and then jumped to Millennials far too early, which significantly narrowed the window allotted to Gen X. Personally, I view this as a good thing. Being a latchkey kid (the opposite of helicopter parenting), growing up in NYC in 70s and 80s, being too old to care about the Disney renaissance, not being online until I was in my 20s, I credit all of these things with being a happy, healthy well-adjusted adult.Report
I am SHOCKED by the number of people I work with (at the WWII newsletter) who are still at work into their late 70’s and 80’s. Some of them (God love ’em) are not exactly firing on all cylinders, either – can’t use technology, fear change – even things like PayPal, behave in ways that are not acceptable in 2021, are very forgetful, etc. Making laws like mandatory retirement is very much not my cup of tea (except for politicians, LOL, all in on that) but boy, it would have been nice to see those opportunities open up for people in mine and your age group, Oscar.
As I look back over the course of my and my husband’s working careers, and now our adult sons have started careers too, we get to this point over and over again where we’re perpetual underlings for someone higher up the pecking order and no matter how hard we work or how much education we attain (my husband went back to school about ten years ago) there’s never room to advance, there’s no reward to be had, and the pay never gets any better than one step above entry level.
Kinda discouraging sometimes.Report
This is focused more on automation and immigration than on retirement, but the principle is the same. Jobs are not a scarce resource. Boomers staying on the job later not only does not take opportunity away from later generations, but means that we don’t have to pay as much in taxes to support retirees.
https://www.stlouisfed.org/open-vault/2021/january/refuting-lump-labor-fallacy-two-lessonsReport
One, Lump of Labor treats all jobs as jobs, i.e. the jobs at the Executive level is counted the same as the jobs at Entry Level. Two, Lump of Labor is concerned with the long term trend, and your link even says that things like recessions can have ‘short term’ impacts.
So we have two caveats, how long is long-term and short-term? Is it long enough to damage a career by creating an employment gap that gets flagged by software, or by creating the appearance of career stagnation because the short term recession caused a lack of opportunities? The second caveat is the quality/level of opportunities. If you have an aging population that occupies the bulk of top-level positions and refuse to exit, then we need to look not just at the number of jobs added to the market, but the levels those jobs exist at and the risk involved in leaving a workplace where advancement opportunities are largely shut-out*, for a start-up or younger company that is not as established. Again, LoL doesn’t look at the relative risk of those jobs, only that they are jobs.
Finally, as for tax support, SS & Medicare are effectively fixed, are they not? These are essentially entitlements. You hit a certain age, and you start drawing on them, regardless of need. So what additional tax burden are retirement age citizens imposing on us, aside from not being required to have a DNR order at some point? How many retirement age persons do not have sufficient savings to live without working? Are we examining and criticizing those persons and their spending habits the way we do younger people? Shouldn’t we be telling them to stop living in expensive cities or insisting on living by themselves for the sake of their dignity?Report
Nancy and Mitch are not Boomers. Boomers were born between 1946-1964 give or take. So the youngest Boomers are still in their 50s and a long time away from retirement. Also Nancy has no indulgement of anti-vaxx anything and it is a bit of a BSDI to compare them,
That being said, I agree that the U.S. currently seems to have a big issue with gerontocracy. My parents were born in 1946 and 1947. You can argue that they did not really come into political prominence until 1992 when Clinton was elected (first boomer President) and a lot of Boomers were elected to Congress. It is nearly 30 years from that election and Boomers are still dominant in politics. Meanwhile, I am over 40, have a mortgage and a job, and still feel at times like my cohort is kept at the kid’s table in many ways. Plus lots of our bosses are still Boomers who refuse to retire.Report
My dig at Nancy & Mitch was less about Boomers and more about people not effing retiring and making room for others (thus the mandatory retirement bit*).
*Note that if we did have some kind of global mandatory retirement, we’d have to have much more robust and meaningful social security, or something.Report
Good luck with that. I have a theory that a loot of boomers and remaining silents, especially if they are well-compensated, white collar professionals, think retirement = death. They have outlived “hope I die before I get old” and the next step to that is “hope I don’t die.”
Greatest Gen types remembered the grinding poverty of the Depression and the hell of WWII. Retirement must have been a minor miracle to them as a concept. Before that it was work until dead.Report
“Before that it was work until dead.”
Yep, and usually you were dead before 65, so you still exited the workforce.
Like I said, I doubt we could do any kind of mandatory retirement without really stepping up social security or strengthening 401Ks.Report
Slight disclaimer about this piece – there is a small element of fat-shaming here, which as some of you already know, is very much not what I am about at all. Not only do I think fat shaming is gross and wrong, an opinion I’ve gone public with on several occasions (here’s one) https://atomicfeminist.com/2019/05/01/mata-hairy/ I am also fat myself, as is my husband and two of my kids. Anyone who feels offended by that element of this piece, I apologize.
I included that note in my piece because being overweight truly does raise your risks of dying of Covid considerably, and also because it’s yet another arena where Baby Boomers think they can have their cake, and eat it too (literally) in the form of making a lifetime of personal choices that were very much not optimal for health, yet now expect other people to then be forced to give up their entire childhoods, teen years, and young adulthoods to protect them in no small part because of that choice. It felt important to me to not gloss over that when making my case.Report
Thanks goodness that a rampant Age-ist doesn’t fling insults about fat! Whew!Report
I googled “opposite of stan” and found a person who humbly suggested “blanche.” As in “Kristin seems to be a Boomer Blanche.” And to anyone who “feels offended by that element,” I apologize and send my thoughts and prayers.Report
Has to be “Ollie”.Report
I actually considered that as a possible choice, but I have too much respect for him/them to go there. On the other hand, at the risk of raising some ire, I’m not a big fan of Mr. Williams…Report
“Stan”, says the Urban Dictionary, is a portmanteau of “stalker” and “fan”. So, combine “avoider” and “hater” to get “Vader”. (I’m not at all a fan of George Lucas.)Report
As always, no Darth of humor and insight from Mr. Schilling.Report
You said:
And a Very Merry Vitriol to you as well!Report
Daaayaaamn… as much as I like me some Boomer Bustin’ I felt like I should spritz a little water on some of the flames here.
I take your point about the Boomer narcissism… we GenX can spot it a mile away. But my experience of the Covid-Lifestyle clique has been more Millennial/GenX crossover. So some of this feels, to me anyhow, like we’re flaming the meme spreaders not the meme makers.
Oh well, I’m in the ‘sane’ camp that thinks people should avail themselves of the vaccine to mitigate against a disease that we’re going to get as it becomes endemic. It is prudent to get the vaccine, and the best policy is to keep them free, easy to get and ubiquitous. The less we talk about them, the better. Get the vaccine, go about your business. Everyone else? Shhhh.
There is no Zero-Covid option (and there never was). When you get Covid, you want to get it vaccinated.Report
Socialize the losses and the costs.
Privatize the profits.
It’s a sweet gig, if you can get it.Report
1. It’s interesting to me that the OP touches on memes and other social media communications from Boomers that mock the unvaxxed. What I see from the Boomers in my life are the converse: mocking vax advocacy, mocking caution about Covid-risky interactions, exasperation with pro-vax people and Covid-prophylactic rules, distrust/resentment of vaccines and masks. And the mockery and inflammatory emotions projected in those memes, those messages is every bit as polarizing and every bit as unpersuasive as the ones discussed in the OP.
2. Messages like the ones at the root of the OP’s complaint are probably filtered to each of us individually such that the algorithms are steering us to engage with things that inflame our passions and arouse our anger and fear. By lightly and repeatedly tapping at your amygdala, the social media machines keep your eyes and minds and attention focused on themselves and therefore capture you as an audience. Be aware, even as you feel those stimuli, that this is manipulation, and you need to emotionally distance yourself from it if you want to make an autonomous rather than a reactive decision about what you see and what you do. (This is not always easy to do.)
3. I suspect vaxxing or not vaxxing is probably a political/cultural phenomenon rather than a generational one. It’s easy for we X’er/Millenial types to project our resentments on Boomers. After all, Boomers, especially in the USA, won kind of a historical lottery in the amount of wealth and power the world offered them. They have hubris was thinking that those changes were somehow permanent. I’ve got to think that we’re basically jealous of the unusually good historical hand of cards our parents got dealt as we experience a sort of reversion-to-mean phase of history, so that allows us to find generational common ground even as we differ on other matters.
4. Maybe debate is bad. After all, debate and argument they are practiced in our world don’t really exist to persuade. Debate is not about figuring out who is right about what, nor to advance the participants and audience towards the truth. It’s about rhetorical tactics and the goal of a debate is to win. while Memes, particularly the ones using sharp, cutting humor, are a rhetorical tactic that, if they are aimed at anything at all, are aimed at winning a debate rather than convincing others that they are right: entertainment value makes a statement more appealing. It may be that the best we can hope for out of debate is an articulation of what people of different perspectives think, and even then we need to take it with a grain of salt because what is said in the fire of debate typically generates heat but not light.Report
There is a great podcaster/creator Dylan Marron who doesn’t like debate. He has a concise description of debate as ” gamified conversation” which gets to the problem. Gamified communication is all about winning something which is not going to lead to learning anything. He also often says “empathy is not endorsement” which is good to keep in mind if we want to fully hear someone and helps move productive conversations along. I think he is right in both quotes.Report
I guess this begs the question of “Why do you come to a place like Ordinary Times and bother with the comments sections at all if you think debate is bad?” In part, it’s that I’ve come to like a lot of all y’alls; in part it’s what Saul and I discuss below; in part it’s rare that I read anything here that changes my mind, but sometimes I do, and that’s a remarkable pleasure indeed.Report
“1. It’s interesting to me that the OP touches on memes and other social media communications from Boomers that mock the unvaxxed. What I see from the Boomers in my life are the converse: mocking vax advocacy, mocking caution about Covid-risky interactions, exasperation with pro-vax people and Covid-prophylactic rules, distrust/resentment of vaccines and masks. And the mockery and inflammatory emotions projected in those memes, those messages is every bit as polarizing and every bit as unpersuasive as the ones discussed in the OP.”
Or as the meme goes in my part of the social media world:
“Your parents in 1996: Don’t trust anything on the internet.
“Your parents in 2016: Freedomeagle at facebook.com states that Hillary Clinton invented aids.”
Now this is not my parents who were always liberal, being that I am basically descended from a New Deal, Jewish New York families.* They took COVID seriously and everyone was vaccinated and boostered as soon as possible. Basically, I think you are spot on for number 3 as well especially the first part and probably the rest of the paragraph but since I am a liberal and the OP is not, the anti-boomer stuff I see is all about mocking “Old Economy Steves,” people who stiill think Regan is the bee’s knees (some boomers and older Gen Xs had their 20s coincide with the Reagan 80s), and sorryantivaxxer.com stuff. Mike Lindell is a boomer as are lots of other die-hard Trumpists.
Even Babitz (technically not a boomer but a late Silent) died recently. In the 1960s and 1970s, she was known as a Hollywood IT girl who dated movie stars and other celebs, both men and women. She also wrote essays and books about good times in Hollywood during these wild days. She is the women in the famous photograph of a nude woman playing chess with a 76-year old Marcel Duchamp. According to her obit, she suffered a bad burn accident in the late 1990s which turned her into a recluse. During this period, she started listening to talk radio and made a big right-wing turn. I don’t know if this last paragraph is related to anything in your post but it does seem to go with how a lot of media triggers reaction.Report
Your brain is like the rest of your body — it works with the raw material you feed it. If Ms. Babitz began a diet of nothing but right wing talk radio it is unsurprising that she intellectually became what she intellectually consumed.
Let’s all make a point of keeping a heterogenous mental diet.Report
The Bulwark is okay and French can write some stuff every now and then but I have grown skeptical that being exposed to all ideas neutrally is an unalloyed good. A lot of it can be vile (outright Trumpist fascism) or a lot of deliberately obtuse concern trolling that gets lapped up by the kind of liberal too broadminded to take their own side in a fight.Report
Best thing we ever did for my grandparents was to convince them to only watch the news from 5:00 to 6:00, and only local news.
They calmed down considerably. 24-7 news channels really prey on anxiety, as it’s a constant drumbeat of the same stuff that makes it sound incredibly urgent and important.
The evening news hour will always try the “Are pedophiles driving your kids to school” stuff, but it’s..one story, once a day.Report
Her first book is a wonder. The others were good, for the most part. I was glad she got “rediscovered” while she was still alive to appreciate it. The bio on her is fine, but like I said here, read her first book:
https://ordinary-times.com/2020/02/09/sunday-morning-hollywoods-eve-and-eves-hollywood/Report
” After all, Boomers, especially in the USA, won kind of a historical lottery in the amount of wealth and power the world offered them. They have hubris was thinking that those changes were somehow permanent. I’ve got to think that we’re basically jealous of the unusually good historical hand of cards our parents got dealt as we experience a sort of reversion-to-mean phase of history, so that allows us to find generational common ground even as we differ on other matters.”
I find this to be such an odd claim. I kind of get it. The Unites States occupied a very special position at the end of WWII. Much of Europe was in ruins. A good portion of the world was behind the Iron Curtain. And Asia was still desperately poor. The U.S. had half the world’s productive capacity, which allowed for an economy that brought an awful lot of Americans out of poverty.
At the same time, poverty during the 1950s and 1960s was still high by present-day standards. The high school graduation rate was in the 60th percentile and only about 15% of people graduated college. And the level of consumption for middle class Americans was much lower than it is today. I tend to think that a lot of nostalgia for the post-war era comes from people assuming that they would be born into a stereotypical white upper middle class, suburban family. The reality was more prosaic, although I suppose some people put a very high value on living during a time of palpable progress and the present-day certainly feels as if progress has stalled.
I don’t know how to resolve this. But perhaps let’s try a thought experiment: Tomorrow, you walk outside your front door. The sky opens up and the Lord God herself descends from the heavens and says, “My child, I have bad news and good new. The bad news is that this life is over for you. The good news is that you will be reborn into a new life. You cannot choose who you will be in this new life. You cannot choose your gender, your ethnicity, your sexual orientation or how wealthy or poor of a family you will be born into. However, you will be an American citizen. And you can choose the year of your birth.”
Given those parameters, how many people are choosing to be born between the years 1946 and 1964?Report
I’d rather take my chances of being poor and in a racial minority in the 1960’s than in the 1860’s. Not that it’d be great. But being poor, gay, minority, etc. would present very serious problems no matter when you pick to come back.
The real question is whether you’d take the Boomer years or you’d take a re-do of the X’er life. I don’t think I’d really want to go back any further than being born during or before WWII.
The allure of selecting into the Boomer era would be that opportunities to make good were much more abundant than they’d ever been before and, like the pessimistic X’er that I am, more abundant that I suspect they will be again for a long time.
Another downside to the game, but one that I think is going to be as universal as the risk of being in a disadvantaged group, is that until about the 1990’s, everyone smoked, like, all the time and I remember what it smelled like from my childhood. Nasty.Report
I was going to say the same re: 1. It may be because I’m West Virginian but yeah, the overwhelming majority of boomer meme-ing I see mocks the pro-vax contingent. My vaxxed and boosted mother included, though hers are less about vaccines and more about the other pandemic related restrictions (she really loves those “special kind of stupid” memes, specifically with a photo of Sam Elliot on them.)Report
It really, _really_ is. Holding anti-vax views is directly correlated with distrust in the government. Well, sorta: People who trust the government trust vaccines. People who do not trust the government but can separate out ‘medical science’ from ‘the government’ trust vaccines also. People who do not trust the government and think ‘medical science’ is included as part of that also do not trust vaccines.
This has always been true about vaccines, even well before Covid. Even the anti-vaxers on the left were anti-government, just more in the ‘hippy’ style than the way the right tends to express it. They tend to blame ‘Big Pharma’ and think of the government as dupes vs. people on the right who tend to blame ‘the government’ and think medical science is in their pocket, but it’s exactly the same thing from two different directions.
(Oh, and as a Georgian, I want to second what Em just said: The vast majority of memes I see are mocking of pro-vax position, and the stuff I see from the other side is trying to use charts and crap to convince people, and is not ‘mocking’ anything.)Report
But there’s a 25-point difference in COVID-19 vaccination rates between Millennials and Boomers. Adults under 40 are at about 60%, while adults ages 55-75 appear to be at around 85%.
https://www.mayoclinic.org/coronavirus-covid-19/vaccine-tracker
This makes sense from a rational-but-kind-of-dumb perspective. For older people, not being vaccinated is really dangerous, whereas for people under 40 the risk is fairly limited. The risk-reward calculus still favors vaccination, but not as strongly.
Your social bubble appears to be the opposite of mine. People I know IRL are mostly peer-pressure Democrats. They can’t rigorously defend their convictions, but they sure do hold them tightly. So I see a bunch of low-info pro-vaxx memes. They’re not wrong about vaccines being good, but the quality of the arguments suggests that they’re right largely by lucky coincidence.
My Internet bubble is more high-IQ/low-agreeability, so I see a lot of high-effort but subtly fallacious anti-vax stuff involving charts and data analysis. It’s a master class in the perils of doing your own research.Report
So a question there: How much of that was an actual ‘decision’, and how much of that is just that vaccines for older people were available _first_ and got pushed heavily during rollout, and a good chuck of this antivax stuff didn’t get momentum until later, not until after the point that a significant amount of older people were already vaccinated?
I mean, I mostly see what you’re saying, but…memes in real life? What do you mean?
Anyway, the side that has the minority belief doesn’t get to post very dumb memes and assume everyone will agree with them. They have to rationally state positions, or at least try.
The Facebook groups I’m in that are merely geographically bound, like my town’s ‘Say What You Want’ group, are, uh, full of rather dumb people, people who seem to be mostly older people, with very uninformed anti-vax memes, and the occasional counter-post of ‘Here are the facts about this nonsense’. They’re full of rather dumb conservatives even outside of that, and I don’t say that because I think conservatives are dumb, I say that because they really are kinda dumb…although a good chunk of that is probably the weird uncritical repeating of things I legitimately suspect are Russian propaganda.
…which again, is probably due to the assumption that everyone agrees with them, and they don’t _have_ to present intelligent arguments.
The groups I am in that have other aspects, like theater or tabletop gaming or queer people or whatever, and are often full of younger more-liberal people, and it’s just assumed everyone is pro-vaccine. No one bothers to try to convince anyone of anything…and there really aren’t the memes. If anyone is talking about Covid, it’s ‘Things are looking good.’ or ‘Oh shit, things are looking bad.’.
Things posted by my friends on their timeline tend to not be memes, but, OTOH, I already don’t follow the people who enjoy posting memes, and for all I know they’re posting a flood of pro- or anti-vax memes, I don’t know.
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Honestly…I think the fact we’re ignoring is that a lot of what is being described in this article is, in fact, TROLLING. It’s deliberately trying to get a reaction. Almost all memes are designed as trolling, which is…why I don’t really follow people who post memes on their timeline, and only see them in groups.
In fact, talking about social media memes like they somehow have anything to do with reality is…very silly. There are indeed a bunch of heartfelt posts from bother pro- and anti-vax people, making claims they think are logical (Which is unrelated to their actual correctness.), and then there are…memes which was mostly intended to call an entire group of people stupid and the point is to have nine out of ten people say ‘Hell yeah!’ and the tenth react in anger.Report
The Boomer thing kind of reminds me of the White Privilege thing.
Being a Boomer was easy mode. Yeah, there was a lot of exploitation. Sure, they sold the birthright of others for a mess of pottage.
The pop culture stole liberally from other places without giving any credit whatsoever.
But, you know, the music was pretty good.
Pity about the counter-culture becoming the culture. It was better when it had a well of moral authority to draw from. Now it’s moved from David vs. Goliath to David versus Uriah.
I’d feel better if there were a Solomon out there. Or had gotten the first half of Solomon instead of the crappy second half.Report
Related to COVID but I am currently in Singapore and the COVID public health measures here would probably have most Americans screetching. I am not sure even the most, COVID serious blue cities and states could implement them successfully or without protest. Americans are big, irrational COVID babies.Report
For one thing, you’d need a mayor willing to follow their own mask mandates.
And a citizenry willing to hold her accountable for not doing so.Report
Why are you such an over grown, miserable middle-school miscreant?
What value does your trolling add to anything? Who made you the greatest truth teller ever to tell the truth? Why do you think hiding behind “cutesy bootsy, look at me I am a big 9 year old” hides any of this?
We have been through this. You are taking one account from one media source as the unvarinshied truth that London Breed violated the SF mask mandate because all of your priors are primed to want to jump up and down like a howler monkey and scream hypocrites at Democrats. Meanwhile, in the actual city that voted for her, in the actual state where she resides, it has become a nothing burger.
What evidence do I have that anything you write is in good-faith?Report
Saul, you were saying “I am not sure even the most, COVID serious blue cities and states could implement them successfully or without protest. Americans are big, irrational COVID babies.”
I was agreeing with you.
And I was using the example of a city leader who was not following her own mandate and, instead of being held accountable for doing so, was defended and it was pointed out that we didn’t have the whole story. Or, pardon me, we didn’t know whether or not we had the whole story.
What evidence do I have that anything you write is in good-faith?
I suppose I’d ask you to look at the truth values of the statements. If you find yourself more likely to switch to “I’d rather find reasons to discredit the speaker than look at the truth value of the statements”, I’d suggest that we’re not in a “good-faith” place in the first place.
(As for “miserable”, I don’t think I am. At worst I’d say I suffer from melancholy but I understand that that goes with the territory of having the soul of a poet.)Report
In response to “Americans are a bunch of Covid babies”, judges would also have accepted the beam of:
“We would need the most watched cable news network not to push anti-vax hysteria, while strictly enforcing its own vaccine mandate, and a viewing audience that could accept that.”
Or:
“We would need the major opposition party not to push anti-vax and anti-mask nonsense, and a voting base that didn’t demand it do so.”
Or:
“We would need the governors of states having our largest populations of at-risk seniors not to actively block sensible pandemic measures, and a voting base that would reward them for doing so.”
Instead of the mote of “something something mayor so & so.”
I know that for any given comment, you have a gnawing hunger to find “B-but the Demonrats are worse!!” but with regard to Covid, the Republicans have defeated your very best attempts.Report
Jaybird just has a compulsion to argue the Democrats are worse and sigh about why substack won’t pay him oodles of money.Report
(Substack? What the heck?)Report
Chip, Saul wasn’t saying “Man, we’d be able to pull this off if only Republicans could get on board” but “Man, even Democrats wouldn’t be on board with this stuff”.
And I agreed with him, providing him with an example of a democratic politician who flaunted her own mask mandate… not only because it was an example of a democratic leader not following her own rules, but because it was an example that resulted not in “yes, she should follow the rules that she expects others to follow” but “HOW DARE YOU QUESTION A BLUE MAYOR”.
Freddie had an awesome essay the other day talking about this sort of thing. It’s called “Social Responsibility To Do What?”
He talks about how he’s following all of the rules of vaccination and getting boosted and masking and all that but he’s not impressed with the whole “outsourcing risk to low wage workers” thing that people who have their groceries (or restaurant prepared meals) are doing.
I know that, for my part, I have done the vaccination and booster and masking thing and, on top of that, I went a year without seeing friends that I missed, I rarely visited family that I very much wanted to visit, and followed all of the so-called “rules” that were put in place.
When I see leadership say “this is bullcrap, we’re ending the lockdown”, I may think “it’s premature” but I certainly understand how someone might look around and say “this is bullcrap, we’re ending the lockdown”.
But when I see the leadership say “WE HAVE A MASK MANDATE!” and then see leadership not masking while out on the dance floor, I get the feeling not that leadership is trying to lead, but that leadership is trying to free ride off of my vaccination, booster, masking, etc, status.
And then when I see people actively defending leadership doing this, I look at the whole “this is bullcrap, we’re ending the lockdown” thing with fresh eyes and see that only one of the leaders is saying “we’re all in this together” to those of us who got the vaccine, got the booster, wore the masks, etc.
And it ain’t the one defying her own mask mandate.Report
In this together? Fox has a vaccine mandate.Report
I got my shot on the second day it was available to me (didn’t get scheduled quickly enough). I got my second shot on the first day it was available to me. I got my booster within a couple of hours of getting the text saying I was eligible.
I did the masking thing. I did the social distancing thing. I abstained from visiting family and friends. I followed the rules.
I resent the leadership that wrote the rules (and then failed to follow them) far more than the leadership that screamed that the rules were bullshit.
I did my part. I understand why the people who think that the rules are bullshit don’t want to follow them.
Why can’t the people telling me how important these rules are follow them?
Why in the hell do these leaders who do not follow their own rules have so very many ardent defenders?Report
Fox is paying people a lot of money to say “Don’t worry about it” while making goddam sure no one who believes their BS gets anywhere near them.Report
If I wanted to convince people that covid was dangerous, I’d ask people to ignore what people are saying and, instead, look at what they are *DOING*.
What I’m gathering is that Fox would be a good example to point out to people that I’d want to convince to get vaxxed and wear a mask.Report
Fox is a good example because their corporate policy isn’t privileged. I suspect the figures on the Right that are being coy about their states (DeSantis, Carlson, etc.) or flat-out insisting they’re unvaxxed (e.g. Palin) are vaxxed and boosted, but that’s impossible to prove.Report
Well, if we were trying to find overwhelming evidence that Saul was 100% correct that even the most, COVID serious blue cities and states couldn’t implement these anti-COVID policies successfully or without protest, I think we’ve done so.
We can’t even bring up a politician failing to follow her own mandates without “what about Fox! What about red states!” questions.
Say what you will about Singapore, but if Lim Hwee Hua was seen maskless on the dance floor for the second time in three months, Singaporeans would not be asking “but what about India?!?” when questions started being asked.Report
Republicans and the entire conservative political world have been overwhelmingly worse on Covid, both in their words and actions, than any combination of Democrats.
This is objectively true.
Just take the point and move on.Report
Chip, while I appreciate that you want to argue against the point of “who is better on Covid”, I’m interested in Saul’s point of “I am not sure even the most, COVID serious blue cities and states could implement them successfully or without protest.”
Get this: I AM AGREEING WITH HIM.
Why? Because even examples of COVID serious blue cities failing to implement their own half-assed public health measurements do not get responses of “yeah, there’s no way we could do what Singapore did… not even in COVID serious blue cities” but “WHAT ABOUT CONSERVATIVES WHO DON’T THINK COVID IS A BIG DEAL?!?!?”
Saul was 100% correct. 100%.Report
Because, even confronted with a deadly disease, we are all 12-year-olds yelling “It’s not fair!”?
I’m not going to disagree.Report
DeSantis and Carlson are obviously vaccinated. I can see Palin and Boebert bein dumb and defiant true believers.Report
We would need the major opposition party not to see their leader’s saying “I took the vaccine and you should seriously consider it” as the ultimate betrayal.Report
At some point, millennials are going to realize that they are just ‘Boomers +40 years’ and that is going to cause a serious crisis of self-regard. But don’t worry, I am sure that Gen Z and whoever comes next will treat y’all with all the kindness and understanding that you deserve.Report
I’m hoping that the habit of naming generations will die out.
Until the Boomers it wasn’t a thing and it really doesn’t need to be a thing.
The only reason the Boomers were called “the Boomers” is because there was a boom in births in the post-war period.
There wasn’t any connective tissue that bound that age cohort together,. not any more than any other generation before or since.
The media likes to craft a definition of them- e.g. they all listened to rock & roll, drank Pepsi, and were hippies but that was never true. It was true of a very narrow band of the cohort (typically the demographic of the sons and daughters of the people who create media), but was false for a much larger band.
Gen X, Millennials, Gen Z, whatever…there really isn’t any useful point in throwing a term over the entire age cohort. It doesn’t give us any better understanding of them than say, defining them by some other demographic metric.Report
I agree to an extent that these categories are vapor. But (and this is a big but) pop culture goes a long way towards defining our reality and pop culture takes these categories seriously.
There are a series of stories that we tell about America from the 1950s to the 1980s (the innocence of the 50s, the rebellion of the 60s, the hedonism of the 70s, and the tack towards stability in the 80s). These stories just happen to map quite well onto the age and stages of development of the Boomer generation. That kind of thing creates its own reality.Report
There was this great movie called Cooley High, about four high school buddies in 1964. When I first read the synopsis and read that it had a “great soundtrack” I was eager to see it, assuming it would have a lot of Beatles, Elvis and Stones songs.
But those groups didn’t even exist in the movie; The soundtrack was all Motown stuff, because this was a story of four black high school buddies.
The movie had this weird feel, unlike any “early 60’s” movies that i had seen. Weird because the world these kids inhabited was not the Boomer world that the media likes to talk about of beatniks and mods and rockers and budding hippiedom.
The movie Platoon made a point of this, that the Boomers in the movie were splintered into various tribes- the Willem Dafoe tribe of suburban hippie types, and the Tom Berenger redneck types.
I think the distance between groups within an age cohort are wider than the distance between cohorts.Report
The Lost Generation was a thing, thought it was a tiny fraction that got to go to Paris, drink, and pretend to be artistes.Report
The reason you see so many Millennial vs Gen Z vs Boomer headlines is because its click bait for publishers. These comments are case in point. Stats on this story are probably through the roof.
Generational terminology will never die out because we are a nation of narcissists. What are they saying about “us” now??? Click, click, click …Report
I guess we’ll never get to be the fun grandparents; we’ll always be the uncool parents that ask if you’re going to go outside dressed like that.Report
I honestly think Boomers get better once they get away from media. My mother went through an period where all she wanted to talk about was Obama putting conservatives in concentration camps and how we force unwilling women to have abortions in Canada, because of Communism, obvs. What made it painful, rather than irritating, was she was so fishing dour and miserable all the time. She started telling me she was happy to die soon because she won’t see America fall, and other cheerful things.
Then, mirabile dictu! she stopped watching “the news” and started reading the e-books I’ve been sending her (she’s also an avid reader) and she’s noticeably happier. I would like to hope she will be happier for the rest of her life, however much is left.Report
“I have this great abortionist, but you wouldn’t know him. He’s from Canada.”Report
I remember the Kids in the Hall having a bit about a small town Canadian abortionist. Can’t find it online though. It was suitably cringey.Report