Whataboutism and The Rise of the Flip Wilsonicans
During her floor speech before she was stripped of committee assignments and relegated to Tweeting at her fellow members of Congress from the sidelines, Marjorie Taylor Greene uttered a rather remarkable string of words:
But you see, here’s the problem. Throughout 2018, because I was upset about things and didn’t trust the government, really because the people here weren’t doing the things I thought they should be doing for us, the things I just told you I cared about. And I want you to know, a lot of Americans don’t trust our government, and that’s sad.
The problem with that is, though, is that I was allowed to believe things that weren’t true and I would ask questions about them and talk about them. And that is absolutely what I regret, because if it weren’t for the Facebook posts and comments that I liked in 2018, I wouldn’t be standing here today and you couldn’t point a finger or accuse me of anything wrong because I’ve lived a very good life that I’m proud of and my family’s proud of, my husband’s proud of, my children are proud of, and that’s what my district elected me for.
Huh?
You could teach a semester worth of psychology and ethics classics just on that part, let alone the other 10 minutes’ worth of the non-apology explainer Rep. Greene doled out.
There were chunks of theology:
These were words of the past and these things do not represent me, they do not represent my district and they do not represent my values.
Here’s what I can tell you. I am being grateful for this opportunity and I’ll tell you why. I believe in God with all my heart and I am so grateful to be humbled to be reminded that I am a sinner, and that Jesus died on the cross to forgive me for my sins, and this is something that I absolutely rejoice in today, to tell you all.
And I think it’s important for all of us to remember, none of us are perfect, none of us are, and none of us can even come close to earning our way into heaven just by our acts and our words, but it’s only through the grace of God.
There was an exposition on the Greene family dynamics:
I’ve lived a very good that life that I’m proud of and my family’s proud of, my husband’s proud of, my children are proud of, and that’s what my district elected me for…
There was of course a heaping helping of whataboutism:
And if this Congress is to tolerate members that condone riots that have hurt American people, attacked police officers, occupied federal property, burned businesses in cities, but yet wants to condemn me and crucify me in the public square for words that that I said and I regret, a few years ago, then I think we’re in a real big problem, a very big problem.
What shall do with Americans? Should we stay divided like this? Will we allow the media that is just as guilty as QAnon of presenting truth and lies to divide us?
And a segue into abortion, which is of course the true hallmark of any good apology for promulgating posts about Jewish space lasers, denying Sandy Hook & 9/11, and remarking the best way to deal with the sitting Speaker of the House was to put a bullet in her head:
And this why I will tell you, as a member of this Congress, the 117th Congress, I am a passionate person, I am a competitor, I am a fighter, I will work with you for good things for the people of this country, but the things I will not stand for is abortion. I think it’s the worst thing this country has committed, and if we’re to say ‘In God We Trust’, how do we murder God’s creation in the womb?
And no modern dance of blame avoidance is complete without the buzzword du jour, “Cancel Culture”:
“I also want to tell you that we’ve got to do better. You see, big media companies can take teeny tiny pieces of words that I’ve said, that you have said, that any of us said, and can, and can portray us into someone that we’re not, and that is wrong.
“Cancel culture is a real thing, very real, and when big tech companies like Twitter you can scroll through and see where someone may have retweeted porn, this is a problem. This is a terrible, terrible thing, but yet when I say that I absolutely believe with all my heart that God’s creation, is that he created them male and female, and that should not be denied.
But consider, if you will, that first highlighted passage again.
I was allowed to believe things that weren’t true and I would ask questions about them and talk about them. And that is absolutely what I regret, because if it weren’t for the Facebook posts and comments that I liked in 2018, I wouldn’t be standing here today and you couldn’t point a finger or accuse me of anything wrong because I’ve lived a very good life…
To use another overused term of the day, Marjorie Taylor Greene is what happens when the rich blonde privilege of having never been told no is made flesh and dwells among us, and a bunch of fools in GA-14 thought it was a good idea to elect this manifestation of never having been rebuffed in her life to congress. It’s the media’s fault, for quoting her word for word and showing the videos she herself made to make herself famous, you see. It’s Facebook’s fault for her spending so much of her idle time chasing conspiracy theories and enjoying the views and likes from making her own media about them. There wasn’t an apology, just a regret that she had documented her lunacy to such an extent that it finally caught up with her and there was no longer a shield from the consequences of how she had conducted herself.
Not that she was going to be doing the grunt work of committee assignments and legislating anyway. Let’s be real here; while she deserved to be stripped of committees, and in my humble but accurate opinion should be expelled from a congress that wasn’t completely craven like this one is, this is the greatest thing to ever happen to Rep Marjorie Taylor Greene. She now has carte blanche to just be the backbench troll she was going to be anyway, but now with a martyr complex to sell during fundraising and even more people to blame for not getting her way.
The only thing missing from her speech and actions afterwards was for her to turn directly to camera, break the fourth wall down, let that grin creep across her face and tell everyone “The devil made me do it” while the laugh track played behind it.
That, of course, was the method and catchphrase of the late, great Flip Wilson. Like all great comedy, it worked because there was a good amount of real life truth baked into the punch line for folks to relate to:
Wilson would do something outrageous in plain sight, then grin into the camera and say, “The Devil made me do it.” The audience would howl because everyone was in on the joke. We all knew that Flip was exploiting a bit of theology to avoid taking responsibility for his bad behavior. All you had to do was say, “The Devil made me do it,” and you got off the hook with your parents, your boss, your teacher, or your partner. It was a “Get out of Jail Free” card and Flip used it week after week.
The difference is, it was absurdist comedy when Flip did it. But not everyone is kidding about this.
Wilson’s routine got us all to laugh at the idea that someone could acknowledge that they had done something terrible, but dodge responsibility by making a theological claim. Whether the subject had robbed a bank, cheated on his wife, or played hooky from school and gone joyriding with his friends, it was all the same. It wasn’t his fault because—all together now—“the Devil made me do it.”
This kind of devil-based theology includes an important but unstated message: When I’m a good boy (or girl), you can attribute my good acts directly to me and my sterling character. But if I behave in horrible, irresponsible ways, just blame it on the Devil, who is running the show.
We are hearing it incessantly these days. It makes one long for the days when personal responsibility at least got lip service. But that’s so passé to the new era of Flip Wilsonicans. It’s easier to fundraise off “The media made me do it” and grow email lists of “Big Tech made me do it” and get votes out with “the other party made me do it”. And then when all else fails, you can always turtle up under the shadow of the cross and remind everyone how we are all sinners so how dare you judge me in the first place you sinning sinner who sins and are sinning right now by even thinking about judging me…
Whatever the reason, all they have to do is turn to camera now and utter the line with just enough grin to let their audience join in on the joke “The [fill in the boogeyman of your choice here] made me do it” and if that doesn’t work then segue how you are practically Christ on the cross as a backup plan.
Which is what Marjorie Taylor Greene did here. This is learned behavior from our political class. Marjorie Taylor Greene didn’t roll out of bed Thursday morning and suddenly come up with that speech; she trained her mind and ethics for years with repetitive behavior of never having been challenged and never being told no, you are wrong. Thus, you get the Flip Wilsonican non-apology that is basically “I can’t believe this is happening to me, do you know who I am oh look murdered babies I love Jesus Dems bad.”
And it isn’t funny. But we’ve allowed it from the body politic, and until we train them with refutation of their behavior, the newest crop of Flip Wilsonicans will keep grinning to the camera and claiming the devil, or the media, or the other party, or whoever else made them do it because they think that is sufficient to get them off the hook and back on the grift. Marjorie Taylor Greene will be made into an avatar for many different things, but she is without question a perfect example of the slew of Flip Wilsonicans we are afflicted with who will never be to blame for anything they ever do.
And the pathetic thing is, until we the American people prove them otherwise, they are right. They will get away with it. The wickedness that plagues our congress doesn’t have anything to do with the Devil. He can just sit back and laugh. We aren’t doing a thing different than he would for him already. Shame on us.
Years ago, there was a news story about nuclear plant meltdown in Japan (before Fukushima). On the front page of the New York Times was a photograph of a press conference in Japan where top executives got on their knees to beg for forgiveness for wrongdoing and negligence? Even back then, I could not imagine any American politician or figure doing the same. Our whole culture is devoted to the non-apology apology in all factors of public life. I do not think this is unique to the United States but it seems dominant here.
Negative polarization does not make this better. It allows politicians to survive scandals that should not be survivable especially if it might make the seat open to the opposition. There is also a lot of bad faith trolling and nutpicking to find instances of the opposition not calling out their own.
I think it was good that the Democrats voted to strip MTG of her committees. Not doing so would have been perceived as weakness and willing to put up with infinite amounts of BS from the right-wing.Report
Fixed that for ya.Report
“On the front page of the New York Times was a photograph of a press conference in Japan where top executives got on their knees to beg for forgiveness for wrongdoing and negligence[.]”
It’s worth pointing out that this is considered a meaningless joke in Japan, a pro forma act that substitutes for actual censure or any change in behavior. It’s the Japanese equivalent of “thoughts and prayers”.Report
The contemporary Republicans have abandoned any pretense to being a political party.
That is, a party that has a coherent belief system about how society should be organized and governed and principles which uphold that system.
A large faction of them do have a belief system of a hierarchy based on race and gender. But the rest are just going along for the ride, coasting on sheer resentment and sense of lost entitlement.Report
Mistermix over at Balloon Juice expressing it better than I can:
It’s been pretty commonly remarked that the Fox-led dehumanization of liberals as some kind of other has led to normalization of calls of violence, and maybe many of those who think the best Democrat is a dead Democrat might well not be abusers, but just misled. I don’t have enough faith in humanity to think that all (or even most) of them have been misled. A big portion of them enjoy the power that comes from inflicting pain on others. They enjoy watching Rashida Tlaib and AOC and others show their pain. They are immune to Steny Hoyer’s eloquent expression of righteous anger that should make any Greene supporter hang their head in shame. There are probably only a few of them serving in the House today, but there are many more in the House who are courting their votes, as last night’s vote showed.Report
You’ve got to be miswired if you didn’t laugh at Rashida Tlaib telling her account of not being in Washington on 1/6. Purely cynical second-hand grief envy. Unless she actually is that emotionally fragile, in which case she should be in some kind of treatment facility.Report
Exhibit A.Report
A heart of stone you must have.Report
What is she doing in Congress if she can’t laugh off a few death threats? Honestly, Dr, Fauci and Hank Aaron were whiny emo about that too.Report
We’ve seen the Dem soviet belief system about how society should be organized. That’s why 2 million guns were sold last month.Report
In Soviet America, gun shoots you!Report
Coming from a family where there were always guns for hunting and such, and plenty of military volunteers, I have always wondered about this. Either the military is on the side of those people, in which case their guns aren’t necessary. Or the military is on the other side, in which case those guns don’t matter. If the Apaches come, and the B-52s are kicking out smart munitions, two million handguns and AR-15s. Simply. Don’t. Matter. Either way.Report
The guns aren’t meant to be pointed at the government, but at their fellow citizens.Report
This, of course, is why we left Afghanistan years ago, after whomping those primitives with their AK’s.
Oh wait, we didn’t?Report
B-52s are great/efficient for population centers, not so good for rural areas.Report
Launch the drones, lock some Hellfire missiles onto confirmed cel phone signals, and call it a day.
I mean, one look at the opsec in the Michigan and Capitol insurrections and every MI specialist in the ranks had to have been doubled over in laughter.Report
Can we please spare ourselves this particular debate? It’s already been hashed out a billion times after hours on bar stools across America.Report
People buying up guns isn’t about taking on the military, it’s about making it daunting to try confiscation.Report
Look, the war on drugs is ending soon.
If you want the cops to be able to shoot minorities, you’re going to have to give something up.
We’ve decided that it’s going to be guns.Report
“Rebellion is useless because the government has bigger guns” does not really make the argument you think it does, sir.Report
I was thinking more along the lines of “There are better plans than dying by the millions shooting it out against the best-armed military of all time.”Report
Sure are, and most of them still involve firearms.
(assuming the political system is fully captured and unavailable)Report
The converse is that sometimes there *are* no better plans.
We’ve well past the point where politics can save this country. We’re already in the first stages of a tribalist conflict, the phase where the warring tribes try to seize the government apparatus in order to serve their tribe’s interest at the expense of everyone else. I know of no cases where that didn’t descend into violence and even outright warfare. When that happens, a whole lot of us are going to be in the wrong tribe and needing weaponry for self-defense–no matter which tribe we’re in. And especially if we try to not be in any tribe.Report
https://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2021/02/the-armed-citizen-2
Guns just lead to murder.Report
Leftism leads to murder.Report
Meat is murderReport
The church of needs has been found wanting.Report
This is what happens when everyone is voting for what they see as the lesser evil. Politicians don’t have to prove they are good leaders, they merely have to sell themselves as “not as bad as the other option”.Report
I don’t think very many Trump voters see him or any his clones as the “lesser evil”.
They really like him, and will vote for him no matter what the choice.Report
I didn’t vote for Democrats because I saw them as a lesser evil. I voted for Democrats because I see them as a force for good and it is the party that corresponds with my beliefs. I am a proud Democrat, not a sheepish one.
There are people who like to think like your statement but I have no evidence that your statement represents majority thought.Report
Not is there no evidence your position is a majority position.Report
In a democracy, the people get the government they earn.
If we have a government of ethically and reality challenged tribalists, that’s entirely on us. We elect them, and we have *nobody* to blame for that. Every such claim is exactly what MTG’s claims are–a refusal to acknowledge that each person is individually responsible for his actions, including the evidence he takes into account and, *especially* the thinking he does or refuses to do.Report
Most Americans don’t want Representatives like Ms. Green to represent them. It’s just that our dumb political system gives the faction that does outsized power.Report
Most Americans weren’t able to vote in the election that got her into office, so it hardly matters what most Americans want. In her district, evidently most of the voters *did* want her to represent them, at least more than they wanted her opponent to represent them–or some third party who might have been better than either.
So long as we refuse to acknowledge that We The People are responsible for the government we have, we will continue to get bad government. And it will keep getting worse, as our “representatives” come to see that we have abdicated our responsibility to place meaningful limits on them.Report
I made a variation f this argument recently on the Facebook page of our Teapublican Congressman. After 6 January there was a bunch of hand wringing at him about either not standing firmly enough with Mr. Trump or being a weak coward for not opposing him. There were many self-righteous calls for him to be defeated next election. Of course when I reminded those folks that we had just had an election, and he had run unopposed after the Republican Primary ( where his tow opponents went down rather flaming, I usually got no response.Report
“I was allowed to believe things that weren’t true…”
Allowed by whom, exactly?
I mean, we are ALL allowed to believe things that aren’t true. And rightfully so. Would she rather have been disallowed from believing things that weren’t true?
In attempting to disavow herself of any accountability, she is essentially denying that she has agency. Which is a pretty damning admission for, well, anyone but particularly for someone who wants to hold public office.
“Look guys… you can’t blame me. I have no control over what I think!”Report
It’s understandable – no public figure wants to describe how bad she is at thinking. I’m happy (kinda) with the results of all this; she distanced herself from the conspiracy stuff completely, and also received punishment. A bit too ceremonial for my taste, but it was a good thing.
But we do need to be having the discussion about stupidity. How should people gather facts and assemble arguments? The former involves new technologies and the impact of our age of distrust; the latter involves time-tested formulas that people need to be trained in. Smart people need to be leading this discussion, and the fact that we get bogged down in partisanship suggests we smart ones aren’t as smart as we need to be.Report
She didn’t distance herself all that much. Distancing would mean saying there was no conspiracy about 9/11 or the school shooting she has been hot on. She needs to directly say what was wrong. As it is she blamed everybody else in the world and said 9/11/school shootings happened. Well we know they happened, that really wasn’t the question. She needs to disavow violence against D pols, school shootings weren’t false flag etc. That would be disavowing.Report
The Terrible Things I Have Said and Done My Entire Life, and Right Up Until a Few Days Ago, Do Not Represent Me As a PersonReport
Less then a month before she says more crazy pants conspiracy crap. I’m being generous.Report
She gave no purchase to any of the stupid things she’s said on social media in the past. I doubt she’s suddenly come to understand how to research and draw conclusions from it, but there was no doubling down at least. None of us would be surprised if she starts up with crazy stuff again, but if she does she’ll be roundly criticized for it. As far as public confessions and show trials go, this was pretty good.
[ETA: Cool! I can fix my typos again! I bet there was some behind-the-scenes work that went into that. It’s always appreciated, guys.]Report
I don’t think it’s a relevant discussion here–I’m done giving public figures the benefit of the doubt when it comes to obvious falsehoods maintained without evidence or contrary to evidence. A person who does that is not fit for office, not fit to wield power, whether they’re dishonest or cognitively incompetent.Report
I’m sorry, I don’t follow. I’m saying that we need to have a discussion of exactly what you said, people believing obvious falsehoods without evidence or contrary to evidence. Whether Greene is expelled or nominated UN ambassador, we need to talk about this. It seems to me that the smarter D’s and R’s have been trying to talk about this for at least five years.Report
I don’t think it’s relevant to MTG and her peers; as I said, I assume that they have chosen to believe as they do, quite independently of the national dementia.
As for the broader problem, the prerequisite for any solution is the abolition of government run or funded schools. Nothing less will allow a solution, and it is *not going to happen*. Discussing that problem is nothing more than mental masturbation, because there is *no* real world solution for it.Report
Why?Report
For the same reason we have a First Amendment and its guarantees of freedom of speech and religion: No democracy can survive when government has the final say on ideas. Government run or funded schools–even if they provide a proper education, which they rarely do–inculcate fundamental ideas into our children, and that *should not* be under the control or even the influence of the government.Report
Wow. So I take it you are not a graduate of America’s public schools? I am, and of the southern variety no doubt, and i can tell you that many of my positions and beliefs were formed in spite of, not through, the schools i attended. Granted, my parents were of the opinion that learning stuff was a full time occupation while i was a kid, and they insisted that I learn how to learn and how to think – probably why I ended up in the sciences as a profession.
As to inculcation – I am unaware of any formal education setting that would be free from inculcation. Religious schools are certainly full of it, and many homeschool curricula are as well.
What concerns me more then your assertion is what you have left unsaid – namely how do we create a civil society working for collective benefit if we DON’T all have a common educational basis?Report
As it happens, I am not a graduate of America’s public schools. I was studying calculus and physics at age 10, after mostly Catholic schools, and was thereafter essentially self-taught. Though I attended college (I started as a Junior when I was 16), I never managed to graduate from high school or college. (Long story. No, I’m not telling it here.)
That said, my personal experience–and yours–are utterly irrelevant to this debate.
You missed the point about inculcation–it’s not that education should not inculcate, it’s that *government* should not inculcate. That’s just as dangerous to a free society as a government controlled press or a government mandated religion.
You *do* know that the founders of America did not “benefit” from a common educational basis of the sort you think essential? Government schools were largely nonexistent for the first hundred years of America’s existence, and it wasn’t until about a hundred years ago that America had universal compulsory “education”.
What civil society requires is *not* a common educational basis, but a common respect for rationality. Compulsion, in the final analysis, is incompatible with rationality, and *that* is why government must stay out of education in a society that intends to be free.Report
I’m always impressed with folks who take a non-traditional path to education, because I find they value that education more highly then others. You certainly prove that point.
And yes I am well aware that as a historical artifact that compulsory government funded education is a relatively new thing. So are electric lights and the internet, and government has had a hand in their spread as well as their development. Were it not so, you and I would not have this lovely platform to debate on.
My main problem with your rationality thesis is that history is also littered with a great many examples of trying to achieve universal respect for a great many things ending in disaster precisely because there is no universal or common mechanism to reach that end. I believe its one of the central failings of libertarianism, in as much as people acting in their own rational self interest will not generally act in a societal or communal self interest except by statistical dumb luck. But boy will they feel free doing so.Report
Lots of words, but none of them address my central thesis, that government controlled education is bad for just the reasons that government controlled press and government compelled religion are bad. Do you intend to address that?Report
Seems to me that addresses your ideas quite nicely. But to put the bow on it – compulsory education is the mechanism that is designed to create that respect space. Is it always fully functional? no, but mostly because we want it on the cheap – like we want so many other things. We want education to benefit ONLY our in group, not “those people” as well. Absent that education, you won’t get that universal respect, which brings me back to by closing statement:
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You have chosen to not engage my actual argument, instead, focusing on a side remark that’s really not relevant.
That said, you *have* made an counterargument to my actual argument, though not explicitly. Your argument, in a nutshell, is that people do not have a right to believe as they will, that they may properly be compelled by the government to believe as the government thinks they should, and that compulsory education is a proper means to that end.
You may reject freedom of conscience, but I do not. I know that a necessary characteristic of a civil society is that its government may not properly dictate what people believe. And, with that, I think our discussion is at an end.Report
You spend an awful lot of time around here dismissing the ideas of very smart people with whom you disagree politically. Perhaps a bit of removing the old eye log first before dismissing the eye speck would do you some good.Report
A good starting point: can smart people have bad ideas, and if so, how? Bad data, certainly. Confirmation bias happens to everyone as well, although mental effort can generally overcome it. Confirmation bias points back to the person’s philosophy, and smart people can have wildly different philosophies. The one thing we shouldn’t see from smart people is flawed reasoning.Report
Smart and *well intentioned* people. Rather a lot of smart people are not well intentioned–they have agendas and they’re perfectly happy to use irrationality to serve their agenda when it seems appropriate.Report
Um yeah, have you actually met many smart people? My lived experience is the smart people have flawed reasoning all the time for the same reasons any human does.
Me thinks however, that you see differences in political philosophy, economic approaches and the like as flawed reasoning. And that being the case, I suspect you dismiss a lot of very sound reasoning.Report
Again you put words in my mouth. I, personally, thinks that you’re demonstrating an inability to follow an argument. I guess I should be glad that you’re putting it right out there that you’re not interested in a non-partisan discussion.
For any other readers: I’m saying that to be truly smart you need to be able to review your thinking. We do all make mistakes, but the kind of deductive errors made by the conspiracy folks are avoidable.Report
See, when you right that clearly, yes, its easy to follow. I also think you have neatly sidestepped my central thesis – which again is that you (and others here) do in fact assess “Smart People” and “flawed reasoning” through an entirely partisan lens.
Now, on your substance – sure, those kind of errors are avoidable.
My question back to you is why do you think “conspiracy folks” don’t avoid them?Report
To have this kind of conversation, we’d both have to trust each other to get beyond partisanship. So far, all you’ve done is voice your distrust.Report
Yes I have. Well informed distrust too. And you keep dodging it, rather than engaging it and showing me why I’m wrong. I don’t trust you to get beyond partisanship. You generally don’t. And in the process you spend a lot of time dismissing people around here who are smarter than either of us because you disagree with them on political or philosophical grounds. It makes your current line of discussion suspect.
You postulated that smart people don’t make reasoning or deductive errors only reason from bad facts, Bill and I both pointed out to you that smart people do make reasoning and deductive errors, and he added the salient reminder of them choosing to do so when they act in bad faith. You engaged him not at all an doubled down against me with your notice that the errors of the conspiracy people are avoidable. Which is true, but clearly not the actual outcome.
So yes I distrust you in this conversation. No, I don’t see anything to refute that distrust. And yes, I think you are reasoning in error with your line of thought, though your data is as good as its going to get on this point.Report
The GOP is going to continue to be the party of Greene, Boebert, Gohmert, Paxton, Hawley, etc, and the party that censures toothless dissenters like Ben Sasse, until they believe it threatens their hold on power. They gained seats in the House and if not for Trump throwing a giant-sized even for him tantrum would have held the Senate, so that time has clearly not arrived.Report
It occurs to me that this has the same energy as that Chotiner interview with the president of the SF School Board, in that here’s a woman who’s learned the code words to say that make people give her things, but she doesn’t know what they actually mean, so when she’s in a situation where she actually has to make an argument all she can do is babble nonsense.Report