The point being, that the Ottomans represent the natural evolution of an initially far more radical ideology. With power, with responsibility, with hegemony, came a liberalization and moderation that has since dissipated in the Arab world--in part due to the collapse of the Ottoman rule and the subsequent rise in nationalism. Hence we can see nationalism inflaming a more radical Islamism and the two working in tandem, fanning each others' flames.

I disagree, Roque. At one point the Ottoman's ruled the region, with their own brand of Islamism, and they were able to trade and dialogue with the West. In some respects, the very moderation of the Ottoman Islamism was what made them great and lasting. It also proves that such a society can exist, and could exist again.

They cannot be negotiated with insofar as their Islamicism—just as we cannot be negotiated with insofar as our Western values. The point of Roy’s piece and your agreement with it is to legitimize Hamas. This cannot happen as long as they adhere to their Islamist world view.

So, essentially you're saying that they will not negotiate their Islamist world view any more than we would our Western--and we cannot dialogue with them until they have given that up.

So...you're saying, in so many words, we can't dialogue ever because they will never give up their world view, and that is a world view that we can never dialogue with. I disagree entirely. They live in their world, and we in ours. We can meet at the same table with two world views and find either common ground or not. How will we know until it's actually attempted?

And keep everything open and transparent. Demand accountability, unlike the debacle with Arafat and his cronies...Require more transparency then we do of our own financial system...

Roque--

I have to wonder whether you are commenting on this piece or on the article you link to.

I think Hamas must be dealt with diplomatically in part to expose them, let their views be heard and challenged in the global theatre. If they don't moderate those views, approaches, etc. then world sympathy will not lie with them, and the Palestinians will have more of a reason to chuck them entirely.

And yes, there is a major distinction between jihadists waging war for a global caliphate and nationalists like Hams, even if Hamas borrows extensively from the others' rhetoric and recruiting tactics.