I'd be astonished. Prop 8 was not very well fought against and had quite a lot of really dishonest assertions levelled against it and still only managed to eke through narrowly. Public opinion has been shifting in the wrong direction and SSM supporters have been learning more about how to deal with this sort of thing for a more draconian version of Prop 8 to pass electorally.
If you're referring to the contraception thing he'd probably have to start out discussing the Catholic leity's assault on Catholic dogma regarding contraception use.
Forgive me, my Tod, I made the very same misreading of your words as Stillwater and Pierre did. I assumed your assertion was that Komen errer when they began working with PP in any capacity. If that were your arguement then acknowledging that what Komen did with PP was in keeping with their core arguement would cut that arguement off at the ankles. Since that wasn't your position your arguements ankles remain sound and whole.
Also under this interpretation I quite solidly agree with you.
Yes that's my understanding as well. Which, I'm sorry to say, seems to cut your point off at the ankles(forgive me, my Tod). If Komen was contributing this money to Planned Parenthood for breast screenings for low income uninsured women then that act, it seems to me, is in furtherance of Komen's raison d'etre.
Ending that contribution to PP, then, becomes in a best case scenario a very lame and unproductive move: it doesn’t help with breast cancer and the reason given (PP is under yet another investigation by various pro-life congresscritters) was laughably lame even before the media unearthed the various smoking gun memos that suggest that abortion concerns were the reason for ending the association; worst case scenario, of course, is that it was moral crusading utterly divorced from their purported mission goal; helping with breast cancer.
Sorry CC, I'd rank to War on Drugs considerably higher than Immigration on the stupid-o-meter. It's hard to think of much that's dumber than the WoT tho so I'll give you that one.
Odd, I'm not getting a limited resource question so much as a "We're doctors and we're not supposed to harm our patients. If we transplant your kidney and you get deported you'll die painfully" response from the hospital. That really sucks but is slightly more defensible than a resource position since, as has been noted, the kidney is only available to him.
Well maybe not completely determined but I'd say most of the major factors are in motion already or are poised to drop. I imagine that the GOP strategists look at all the green shoots popping up on the unemployment indicators and shake nervously. For that matter I imagine Obama's people look at Europe and shake the same way.
A question: do you think that the shuttering of the various government asylums and mental hospitals may have had an impact on this as well. Sure some of those people got taken in by their families, another portion of those people perhaps can function in society on some level and another large portion live on park benches and homeless shelters but I would assume the worst mental cases end up either dead or in prison.
Very interesting. An alternative thought on the last paragraphs of your post; the porn industry has been badly hammered by the flood of amateur and free (or near free) porn that the internet has unleashed. It is possible that rather than relocating what we could consider the porn industry may fragment, shatter and wither. The end of porn as we know it?
Yes yes Scott, just as the right claims free speech while demanding book cencorship (on morality, sexuality, and decency grounds), media cencorship (oh won't someone think of the children!), press censorship (national security), protest cencorship (flag burning) the list goes on and on. My point to ward was that trying to attribute this kind of hypocrisy to only one group in the country and claim that a side as vast as the right is free of such sentiment or behavior is doomed to failure and then quibbling afterwards about which side is "more" hypocritical about this issue or that is a fools errand.
On “Of course, we’re not as bad as the Gulag…”
Really? I'll admit I had a similar moment in reverse when I learned that you can't vote if you're in prison in the US. I was like:
"What do you mean they can't vote? They're still citizens."
<Friend> Oh no, they can't be allowed to vote, they're criminals, think of what/who they've vote for.
<Me> Oh come on, there can't be enough prisoners in US jails to actually constitute a significant voting bloc.
<Friend> ...
On “Prop 8 Open Thread”
I'd be astonished. Prop 8 was not very well fought against and had quite a lot of really dishonest assertions levelled against it and still only managed to eke through narrowly. Public opinion has been shifting in the wrong direction and SSM supporters have been learning more about how to deal with this sort of thing for a more draconian version of Prop 8 to pass electorally.
On “Why People Aren’t Clamoring for Constitutional Amendments”
That's some good writing my Tod. Good job.
On “Of course, we’re not as bad as the Gulag…”
Radically we need to try something else.
Moderately we need to, at least, stop making so many things imprisonable offenses.
On “Chicago-style politics means you don’t bring a knife to a gunfight”
If you're referring to the contraception thing he'd probably have to start out discussing the Catholic leity's assault on Catholic dogma regarding contraception use.
On “Madonna: Always Relevant”
All I can do is confess I don't watch the superbowl.
I did, however, see the Bark Side add which was pure genuis. VW has been getting some serious gold out of that liscence.
On “Where’s TVD?”
By gum, Tom, that's awful but I'm glad you're on the mend.
On “The Real Moment Komen Tripped Up”
Forgive me, my Tod, I made the very same misreading of your words as Stillwater and Pierre did. I assumed your assertion was that Komen errer when they began working with PP in any capacity. If that were your arguement then acknowledging that what Komen did with PP was in keeping with their core arguement would cut that arguement off at the ankles. Since that wasn't your position your arguements ankles remain sound and whole.
Also under this interpretation I quite solidly agree with you.
"
Well yes, money is fungible. That's why it's money.
"
I actually kindof like it.
"
Yes that's my understanding as well. Which, I'm sorry to say, seems to cut your point off at the ankles(forgive me, my Tod). If Komen was contributing this money to Planned Parenthood for breast screenings for low income uninsured women then that act, it seems to me, is in furtherance of Komen's raison d'etre.
Ending that contribution to PP, then, becomes in a best case scenario a very lame and unproductive move: it doesn’t help with breast cancer and the reason given (PP is under yet another investigation by various pro-life congresscritters) was laughably lame even before the media unearthed the various smoking gun memos that suggest that abortion concerns were the reason for ending the association; worst case scenario, of course, is that it was moral crusading utterly divorced from their purported mission goal; helping with breast cancer.
On “Should we let a man die because he is an illegal immigrant?”
Sorry CC, I'd rank to War on Drugs considerably higher than Immigration on the stupid-o-meter. It's hard to think of much that's dumber than the WoT tho so I'll give you that one.
"
Odd, I'm not getting a limited resource question so much as a "We're doctors and we're not supposed to harm our patients. If we transplant your kidney and you get deported you'll die painfully" response from the hospital. That really sucks but is slightly more defensible than a resource position since, as has been noted, the kidney is only available to him.
On “Talking About Class”
Well maybe not completely determined but I'd say most of the major factors are in motion already or are poised to drop. I imagine that the GOP strategists look at all the green shoots popping up on the unemployment indicators and shake nervously. For that matter I imagine Obama's people look at Europe and shake the same way.
"
Politics: better than the alternatives. ~North
On “A Grim Alternative”
Thanks Greg!
"
A question: do you think that the shuttering of the various government asylums and mental hospitals may have had an impact on this as well. Sure some of those people got taken in by their families, another portion of those people perhaps can function in society on some level and another large portion live on park benches and homeless shelters but I would assume the worst mental cases end up either dead or in prison.
On “Underripe Thoughts On Inevitable Litigation”
It should be interesting to see how it all develops.
"
Very interesting. An alternative thought on the last paragraphs of your post; the porn industry has been badly hammered by the flood of amateur and free (or near free) porn that the internet has unleashed. It is possible that rather than relocating what we could consider the porn industry may fragment, shatter and wither. The end of porn as we know it?
On “Insert Your Own McRib Joke Here”
Yes yes Scott, just as the right claims free speech while demanding book cencorship (on morality, sexuality, and decency grounds), media cencorship (oh won't someone think of the children!), press censorship (national security), protest cencorship (flag burning) the list goes on and on. My point to ward was that trying to attribute this kind of hypocrisy to only one group in the country and claim that a side as vast as the right is free of such sentiment or behavior is doomed to failure and then quibbling afterwards about which side is "more" hypocritical about this issue or that is a fools errand.
"
Thanks for sparing me having to plug 60 seconds of time into google Mark.
"
Hypocritically claiming tolerance I'll give you Scott, but no wing embraces morality more loudly, feverently and hypocritically than the right wing.
"
Conservatives and liberals both have their nuts Ward. Neither have the monopoly on speech stifling wingnuttery.
On “David Frum Vs. The Liberal Media”
Gotta echo Morzer here Elias, that first third was written so convolutedly that I almost had to draw a chart.
What this all seems to boil down to is:
-Sully tut-tutted left wing liberals for not liking Obama as much as Sully does. This makes left wing liberals vexed.
-Frum tried to contradict some of the stuff in Sully's article but did a bad job about it.
On “SOTU Reactions”
I don't know whether to laugh or scream nob.
*Comment archive for non-registered commenters assembled by email address as provided.