Lone Star Rising
We’ve come a really long way since the Blue Wall. The Blue Wall, if you recall, was the near-insurmountable electoral college advantage the Democrats enjoyed that assured victory forevermore.
It lasted less than a decade, but in truth it was always illusory. States come and states go. Demographic change is predictive until it isn’t. We should keep that in mind for everything I am about to say.
When I say “we’re a long way” from the Blue Wall, I refer not only to the fact that it crumbled in 2016, but how eight years later we’re looking at an election where Democrats are scrambling to win states that were supposed to be behind the wall. Harris has a good chance with the purplification of Georgia and Arizona, but of the five most swing states she needs to win three and she’s struggling to do so against an aging, disgraced former president.
Gun to head, I currently predict that she will win Arizona, Georgia, and Michigan, and will lose Pennsylvania and Wisconsin. I mention this not to put chips on the table, but because this produces a 274-264 win.
The 2030 reapportionment of congressional seats and EC votes is projected to lead to big changes.
States where Trump currently leads could together gain 13 seats, whereas states where Harris leads could together lose 13 seats. (Another forecast puts the number at 14.) pic.twitter.com/NjL823SvAd
— Stefan Schubert (@StefanFSchubert) October 13, 2024
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And at current trajectory, in 2032 it will no longer be enough. Due to the 2030 census, almost every state gaining population is either red or purple and almost every state losing population is blue or purple. Democrats will have to win not one, but two of the three midwestern states of Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania. In addition to winning Arizona and Georgia. Or to put it another way, the Democratic nominee would have to win almost every single swing state.
Or they will have to win Texas.
Theoretically both North Carolina and especially Florida could also singularly move the election, but Texas alone will have more than 50% of the electoral weight of the main five swing states. Texas currently has 40 electoral votes, but that is set to become 44. Only six shy of California. While the path to victory without Texas is narrow for Democrats, the path to victory to Republicans becomes nearly insurmountable. They have to win all five of the current swing states.
I exaggerate only slightly when I say that the future of elections could be both party campaigns basically living in the Lone Star State.
Democrats have had at least one eye on Texas ever since it went red, but it has largely been a matter of pride. Taking away the Republicans largest and most successful state. It wasn’t necessary to win. The time is coming, however, to play for real.
Will they actually be able to compete in Texas? I’ve long been skeptical, but I’m coming around to the idea. One thing the Democrats seem have a better understanding of is that they can’t really win on demographic arguments. In the past, the growing Latino population was seen as likely to cause an inevitable drift in Texas and elsewhere. To some degree it has happened in Arizona, but Florida has moved in the opposite direction. Texas Latinos tend to be more conservative than most states and a lot of them seem uninterested in solidarity with illegal immigrants and asylum-seekers from Central America. What has mostly opened my mind to it is Georgia, with which Texas has a lot in common and which moved between 2016 and 2020 roughly the same distance as would be needed to make Texas truly competitive.
On the other hand, Texas has remained stubborn. Democrats have been targeting it forever and it has only moved somewhat and the biggest movements have occurred with Trump on the ballot. Trump is not popular there for a Republican and it’s not difficult to imagine the politics of Texas reverting to the mean once he is gone.
The good news for Democrats is that Texas lines up neatly with states recently won (Arizona and Georgia) and potential fallback states (North Carolina and Florida) should Texas stick red. They’re all increasingly diverse states with large black or Latino populations and more educated transplants moving in. So other than campaign expenditures, campaigning in Texas shouldn’t come at the expense of other states.
Predictions are hard, especially when about the future. Georgia wasn’t on anyone’s radar until it was. Maybe there is another state waiting in the wings, but the only two Trump states that were closer in 2020 were North Carolina (which has substantially fewer electoral votes) and Florida (trending in the wrong direction). It’s also possible that without Trump on the ticket the Republicans lose their newfound strength in the Great Lakes region and the possibility of holding on to Wisconsin-Michigan-Pennsylvania doesn’t seem so challenging.
But Texas, potentially with 44 electoral college votes, looks to cast a shadow over everything else. We haven’t had a top two state competitive in a competitive election since 1976, which was an era with a much larger electoral college map with many more moving parts.
Nobody may know what tomorrow brings, but Democrats might want to start fitting themselves in ten gallon hats.
Win the suburbs there, win Texas.Report
Great musings but I remain dubious about Texas. I guess I just don’t know enough about the state to even begin to hazard a guess as to how the Dems would go about flipping it.
You also touch on the big question- what the fish does the GOP/Right look like post Trump? That answer will inform most future electoral questions for the Dems.Report
A lot of what the GOP looks like after is what it looked like before – a minority party trying to cement permanent rule with a highly stratified economic/gender structure where a few rich white men get to run the show.Report
We know the answer already.
Look at Vance, DeSantis, Abbott, Youngkin. Look at the GOP Congressional contingent.
Look at the thought leaders and pundits and policymakers like Steven Miller, Sorhab Amari, Curtis Yarvin. Look at the authors of Project 2025.
Most importantly look at the Republican base voters themselves.
This is what the GOP is and will be for a generation to come.Report
Well the NRA just elected a President who was involved in a particularly gruesome torture of a cat when an undergrad at the University of Michigan so there is part of your answer.
More seriously, I think Trump is one of a kind and has a kind of secret sauce no one else can emulate but I am not sure where they go because plenty of people dislike Trump and perhaps the GOP but have been conditioned to see all Democrats as the second coming of Trotsky while also being out of touch cultural elitists who like icky things like modern dance and mid-century modern furnitureReport
Like Michael says, the key is the suburbs, which is where most of their gains have been made. Along with being conscientious that they can’t take Hispanics for granted no matter how racist the GOP horn toots.
But I believe it’s critical that they figure it out. Having a list of five states and having to win all of them isn’t a very good strategy. Nor is chasing the states that most recently voted for you (if the GOP had done this, they’d have campaigned in Virginia and not Wisconsin).Report
“When I say “we’re a long way” from the Blue Wall, I refer not only to the fact that it crumbled in 2016, but how eight years later we’re looking at an election where Democrats are scrambling to win states that were supposed to be behind the wall. Harris has a good chance with the purplification of Georgia and Arizona, but of the five most swing states she needs to win three and she’s struggling to do so against an aging, disgraced former president.
Gun to head, I currently predict that she will win Arizona, Georgia, and Michigan, and will lose Pennsylvania and Wisconsin. I mention this not to put chips on the table, but because this produces a 274-264 win.”
I am going to dispute all of this. I predict she will win Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin and win one or more of the sunbelt states of Arizona, Nevada, North Carolina, and Georgia. This will provide her a win.
Could I be wrong? Yes. But I have laid out my evidence numerous times and have not heard anyone rebut it with substantive evidence of their own:
1. Democrats are voting sending in more early votes than they did in 2020 and 2022;
2. NBC has an article from September 24 which gives Harris a commanding lead of those who intend to vote early. They also have results which are positive for Democrats in PA, MI, WI so far. Democrats seem to be doing better than expected in Georgia and NC but maybe currently not as well in Nevada and Arizona but this can change.
3. The right-friendly partisan push polls being released can seemingly only get results that show Trump slightly up or breaking even and no one has even attempted to explain to me why I shouldn’t think the actual results are much worse for the Trump/GOP based on the fact that these pollsters only release information when they think it is good for Republicans and they have been critiqued in the past for shoddy polling such as in 2020 and 2022.
4. No one has explained to me why I should think it is accurate for polls to have Josh Stein up by 10-15, Gallego up by 6-13, and Rosen up by around 8, Casey between 4-8, and have those states also be for Trump narrowly or significantly. Gallego himself apparently stated if he wins by 7, Harris wins Arizona and this strikes me as accurate and I think should also hold for Nevada and North Carolina.
5. Black women are apparently coming out in droves for Harris in Michigan per raw story creating an even larger gender gap than previously forcasted,
I think journalists and amateur political bloggers get too into “ohh what if new paradigm?” rather than questioning “Is Trump really going to win 28 percent of the black vote? Really?”Report
If there’s an argument about the polling, it’s this:
The last two elections, the polls were pretty much all incorrect in the same direction. Like, in 2016, Nate Silver was the only person who argued that there was a 1/3rd chance of a Trump squeaker, 1/3rd chance of a Clinton squeaker, and 1/3rd chance of a Clinton solid win/landslide.
And it was the first of those. All of the polls out there knew how to measure the Democrats pretty well, but had no idea how to measure the Republicans.
2020 had a similar thing going on:
*IF* the polls are off again and off in the same direction again, then Harris is in real trouble.
There. That’s the argument.Report
And I personally think they are overcorrecting this year because of 2016 and 2020Report
I wasn’t trying to get you to change your mind.
I was trying to change the circumstance where you said that you hadn’t seen such an argument.Report
And Trump lost the popular vote in 2016 and 2020 despite these errors. One time he received an EV victory and the other time he did not.Report
We had about 5 percent of the country backing Trump and not being willing to tell poll workers that. So now we’ve adjusted for that… but we’re not really sure if that 5% still exists or not.
We could see a crushing Harris victory or a Harris squeaker or a Trump squeaker.Report
So now we’ve adjusted for that
We have?Report
Yes, the view is that pollsters generally are trying to correct for their mistakes of 2016 and 2020. The question is whether this produces a more accurate poll or whether they are overcorrecting:Report
I mean we’re guessing. There is no “evidence” here of something that hasn’t happened yet. Just speculation.
I think most of the arguments you provide could be true, but may not be. Not sure why you’re bringing in Arizona since we both give that to Harris (… though we both may be wrong!)
Ultimately the polling shows an incredibly close race and historically speaking polling in the Great Lakes has underestimated Trump support. Even a very minor underestimation could cost her both of those states.
It’s hard to have too much faith in the outcome either way.
I mostly put my prediction out there as an indication that even a winnable race now becomes a losing race in the future. Even in your scenario, after the projected 2030 census cuts deeply into the electoral college margin. Absent a breakthrough in Texas, Florida, or North Carolina… the electoral map becomes a lot more difficult. (Keep in mind my position here isn’t “Democrats are screwed” but rather Texas is potentially going to move from a vanity project to a key part of the strategy.)Report
Plus Trump appears to be increasingly losing it (39 minute music swaying session), press are finally taking him down on stuff and challenging his surrogates more on his wilder rants, and he appears to be out of cash and so does the rest of the GOP. NBC just reported that the Arizona GOP cancelled its election night party to divert money to campaigns.
Perhaps it is wrong of me but I feel giddier and elated and optimistic in ways I did not feel in 2016, 2020, or 2022.Report
I’ve been of the the opinion that we are in the midst of a decades long battle to defend liberal democracy.
My optimism stems from a few facts:
The battle has finally been joined- Democrats and media outlets (with notable exceptions!) are finally openly acknowledging that the Trumpists are fascists without tiptoeing around the word, and forthright defending women’s rights without equivocation.
Trumpism has remained trapped under a hard ceiling of support- enough to win a national election but only by the grace of the electoral college.
The realignment long predicted since the end of the Cold War looks like it is happening but along the lines of culture war dividing lines.
You have plutocrats like Elon Musk joining with blue collar men, with only the Bitter Divorced Dad bond between them.
Rule by a fascist minority is a real possibility, but it is still going to be a minority nonetheless.Report
It would have been nice if the press could have done this more than a couple of weeks before the election.Report
6 years is a long way off.Report
Six years is also only a short time in the future. 2032 will be here before we know it.
Both my statement and yours are true.Report
The media is reporting that Trump is apparently going to work a fry machine at McDoanld’s on Saturday. Proving once again that we are not a serious people time three trillion. How are his advisers going to make sure he doesn’t hurt himself?
Re my optimism: 2016 and 2020 did not feature a Trump cancelling friendly interviews and questions and swaying to music for 39 minutes. Could there be more voters for Trump to bring out of the woodwork? Perhaps but I somehow doubt it.Report
American candidates have historically made appearances at churches. Since DJT isn’t really a churchgoer, this is probably as close as he’s gonna get.Report
One might argue that as a center of civic activity, the local McDonald’s has taken over for the church.Report
Fake news, God is not in the failed maintenance cycles of the ice cream machine…Report
It’s intriguing watching the number of people who are quite loudly explaining that of COURSE this whole thing was a fake, of COURSE it was staged, of COURSE it was rehearsed and used actors and pre-screened volunteers, are we really so NAIVE that we don’t understand how this WORKS?
And…okay so it’s a staged pre-planned rehearsed event, sure, but then why do it? Why would you do something so obviously intended to play as “here’s good ol’ Don, showing that he knows how to down fries just like you and me, showing us that he gets it because he’s been there” and have it be so completely not real?Report
There are going to be some epic battles over gerrymandering in the Trump states that get new representatives. Most of the growth is coming from internal and external immigration I’m guessing and not exactly Republican. The state legislatures are probably going to want to redistrict in a way that helps the Republicans though. Also NIMBYism is shooting liberal states in the foot.Report
What will be interesting will be how the gender split works with the traditional Urban/Suburban divide.Report
In Texas all the in-migration is to the Texas Triangle, while the Great Plains and desert empties out and East Texas and the Gulf Coast west of Houston is at best stagnant. It’s going to be increasingly difficult to do gerrymanders that “pack” D voters into a few safe districts.Report
Very true. And yet …Report
It’s going to be harder than it was because Democrats are doing better in the suburbs, which was key to the Republican gerrymandering strategy (pack the urban votes in with enough suburban votes that the latter prevails).
It’s also a bit risky to stretch the gerrymander too far because the dam can burst, and since Texas is a rapidly changing state (This burned Democrats in Texas in the 90’s, and Republicans in the aughts and teens) it’s not easy to tell where the votes will be in 8 years.Report
This might just help turn Texas blue: https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/d82e49d897aeb8b27bc07fe5dd11f0a016553dfe2008642391f9cef466baa5c6.png
Q: Why won’t you answer whether you support exceptions for rape and incest?
Cruz: *nervous laughter* why do you keep asking me that?Report
A friend of a friend was Cruz’ roommate at Princeton. Rafael has been a level 11 creep and douche nozzle since at least then. That debate with Allred was something else though in terms of Cruz creepiness and borderline derangement. I hope Allred has a bright political future ahead of him; he deserves it.Report
“At a rally in Atlanta, Georgia, tonight, a slurring, low-energy Donald Trump told the audience: “If you don’t win, win, win, we’ve all had a good time, but it’s not gonna matter, right? Sadly. Because what we’ve done is amazing. Three nominations in a row…. If we don’t win it’s like, ah, it was all, it was all for not very much. We can’t, uh, we can’t let that happen.”
https://heathercoxrichardson.substack.com/p/october-15-2024Report
I can’t help but wonder if he feels like he’s gonna lose, and he’s checking out early.Report
Supposedly he thought he was going to loose the first time, and we saw how that played out.Report
He’s acting like he thinks he’s going to lose. Which is interesting but probably not predictive.
One difference between this year and the previous elections is that he’s not campaigning nearly as hard, whether due to fatigue or disinterest. Will it make a difference?Report
True but I don’t think 2016 is predictive either. We have had four years of Trump and Democrats are more energized against him and so are a lot of women generally because of Dobbs. Democrats can’t treat Trump like a blank slate and neither can the media. Plus his rhetoric is getting more violent.
For the most part, the only polling I have seen over the past few days has been from obvious Republican outfits like TIPP/RMG Research and they are working hard to flood the zone and show the race tightening. Or from generally unreliable pollsters like ActVote (which is apparently done via app) Early voting seems to be going well momentum wise for Democrats and I don’t think we are going to become complacent.Report
I’ll have to start sharing the ones that are not flooding the zone, which are definitely coming in.Report
Trump is not doing that great with white women: https://x.com/SethAbramson/status/1846295845983211603?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1846295845983211603%7Ctwgr%5Ef539e3647f4b40f86a3fc986c39468ebbbf7520a%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fdisqus.com%2Fembed%2Fcomments%2F%3Fbase%3Ddefaultf%3Dlawyersgunsmoneyblog-comt_i%3D14539920https3A2F2Fwww.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com2F3Fp3D145399t_u%3Dhttps3A2F2Fwww.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com2F20242F102Fwhite-grievance-is-the-trump-cardt_e%3DWhite20grievance20is20the20Trump20cardt_d%3DWhite20grievance20is20the20Trump20card20-20Lawyers2C20Guns202620Moneyt_t%3DWhite20grievance20is20the20Trump20cards_o%3Ddescversion%3Db040cc4fb9749f836fa39cae48953897Report
How hard is it just to grab them by the p***y?Report
Wanted to clear something up. I have donated to both the Harris and Trump campaigns. Roughly equal amounts. It allowed my wife and me to meet both candidates and make a more informed decision. I have come to the conclusion that both candidates have their hearts in the right place, and while they would set different paths for America, I am optimistic that either path will be a positive step. I am endorsing both candidates.-Tim Draper, very important venture capitalistReport
“I detest him as a person,” said Natalie Wriker, 37, who works at the Lutheran church in town, “but he’s the lesser of two evils.” She said she believes that politicians are “easily bought” but that Mr. Trump has less motivation to do things for money because of his wealth.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/10/17/opinion/trump-harris-bucks-county-pennsylvania.html
Stupid is incurable in some people. He is the most easily bought President in history probably.Report
As I’ve said before, there is no such thing as an ‘innocent” Trump voter.
He has been endlessly covered every single day in every possible medium for a decade and is the most well known public figure in America today.
Stupidity doesn’t necessarily bend towards evil- a person might choose evil and be stupid, but stupidity could have just as easily selected the one promising peace and prosperity instead of violence and misery.
If there is one silver lining about Trump, is that he isn’t concealing who he is or what he is going to do. He makes that explicit every single day, loudly and all in caps.
Any Trump voter is consciously choosing violence and hatred.Report
Easily bought, but not by cash; Trump’s policies through his presidency were mostly ‘whatever the last cool person I talked to said we should do is what we’re doing now’.Report
Oh please. His gold watch for 100K might as well say BRIBE ME in big neon lettersReport
Trump is had a normal today praising Arnold Palmer’s dick size: https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/852fff9321ba896ee1d348e00a2af4b2d085f3e727067a9e2a1ff5de9a8f60d9.png
Also a lot of recent polling except the Bullfinch Group and ActVote (which conducts its polls via app) is from right-biased outfits like RMG Research and TIPP (who used to be associated with American Greatness)Report
I had a classmate who thought he was the illegitimate son of Arnold Palmer, who belonged to the same golf club as his parents. I can’t say from personal observation whether he shared his putative father’s endowment.Report
Voters don’t like Stop the Steal talk: https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-election/poll-voters-repelled-election-denial-overturning-roe-drawn-economic-pr-rcna175791
“That speaks to the importance of the economy and the cost of living especially at this time, and people being open to potential solutions to drive down the cost of living,” said Democratic pollster Aileen Cardona-Arroyo of Hart Research Associates, which conducted the survey with Public Opinion Strategies, a Republican polling firm.
One economic proposal — “tariffs as high as 20% on goods from all countries” — was not as popular, with 44% saying they are less likely to vote for a candidate who supports that policy, and 35% saying they are more likely to support that candidate.
While economic policies could move voters toward a candidate, the survey also finds that election denialism could turn them off.
A majority of voters surveyed — 52% — say they are less likely to support a candidate who says Trump won the 2020 presidential election, making it the least popular position tested in the survey.
Voters across swing groups, including suburban women, independents, moderates and seniors, say they are less likely to support a candidate who denies the election results. The position only has a positive effect on Trump’s voter base, including self-described MAGA Republicans and conservatives.”Report