42 thoughts on “When Did Being A Jerk Become A Positive Character Trait?

  1. …are we allowed to bring up further examples, or is this just “rarrgh, those Republicans, what a bunch of fucking fuckers, I mean, really” venting?Report

  2. Stein got attention for trolling city council meetings as an overly-enthusiastic vaxxer or race activist. Not the most sophisticated humor, but at least it was clever. I saw bits of clips but never watched one start-to-finish. What he’s doing now makes it seem like he’s just lost.Report

  3. This is Trumpism, which is a form of reactionary fascism.
    It is really just a sulking grievance based ethnic tribalism.

    As we’ve seen with DeSantis, Abbot, and the various pundits and media figures in their orbit, their only goal is to exert dominance and inflict pain and humiliation on the hated Outgroup.Report

  4. Being a jerk was always a positive character trait in some circles. It just depended on who your jerkiness was directed against and whether you can come across as person of status and power doing this. People generally adopt the personality traits that look for them and there are a lot of people who manage to make negative character traits work for them. There are also people who can’t make positive character traits work for them because they come across as weak. Some people are very kind but come across as confident and fun while others have a deer stuck in headlights, please don’t hit me personality.Report

    1. as someone who was bullied in school, I look at what’s going on in culture/politics now and feel like I’m back in seventh grade. Some people really never did grow out of it.

      I will note I am much, much less likely to pay attention to someone’s criticism of a person if they start off with essentially “they’re ugly and their mama dresses them funny” instead of “there are flaws in their ideas, here are the flaws….” But I may be in the minority on that; perhaps rudeness sells to most people?

      At any rate, I hate it, it brings up bad memories of a bad time in my life to see bullies seeming to get the upper hand.

      (And yes, I suppose it always was thus; some of the very old campaign chants were pretty rude; there was one fundamentally based on the rumor that Grover Cleveland fathered an illegitimate child)Report

      1. It makes me wonder, have issues gotten too complicated for easy communication? You could explain an 1822 law pretty clearly, but in 2022 you get 20 pages into a policy paper and just decide it’s easier to insult your opponent.Report

        1. “have issues gotten too complicated for easy communication?”

          no

          people just want excuses to be mean

          and they realized that if you could tie their being-mean to a Moral Issue then it was a perfect way to off-load the guilt of having been mean

          and they don’t even have to feel like this is an intentional avoidance of guilt

          because, after all, who’s gonna suggest that we shouldn’t go to the absolute limit in our efforts to uncover and purge the sins of society

          are you gonna stand up in front a torch-waving mob that’s thoroughly convinced it’s doing the Lord’s work and say “maybe you guys should take it easy”?Report

  5. Alex seems not to have fallen far from the tree based on the D magazine article. I think Chip and Lee have it right, being a jerk has always been a positive characteristic trait in human civilization. What matters is whether you are being a jerk to the in-group or the perceived out-group. How many people think something like this “All lawyers are A-holes….I need a lawyer, give me the biggest A-hole you can find.”

    Humans have never been a particularly altruistic species overall. We are often tribal at varying levels of tribe and people confuse tribalism (“he/she looks out for his/her own”) with altruism.
    Most people probably think Alex Stein and people like him are horrible boors. As one of the article notes, he was on a reality TV show where he proudly proclaimed he had no shame and was dispersed with quickly by the rest of the group. However, he has found a home among people who want hyper-partisan reactionary political “bum fights” as you note.Report

  6. What I do find interesting about this article is that while it recognizes that many Trumpist Republicans are bullies, the writer can’t prevent himself for also making fun of the targets when they are associated with the other side like AOC and Jonathan Chait. Meanwhile, when Republicans like Crenshaw or Buckley are targeted by a mean spat it is bad because they are virtuous.Report

      1. Grillo’s essays are often “Tell me you are a partisan Republican without stating you are a partisan Republican.” Plus he gets upset when people are critical of finance as an industry. Finance types always seem to have the thinnest of skins when it comes to critiques of their industry.Report

        1. Is Grillo a regular here? It looks like he’s written five articles, and made one comment in their threads. Is that enough to be declaring what he usually does? I don’t think he comments here often on other’s articles – at least, I don’t recognize the name. Maybe he writes elsewhere and you’re familiar with his material, so maybe you know enough to know his sore points. It just seems weird.Report

  7. One part of is people failing to differentiate between the right to do something and whether is is good. This is pinging in my head today due to the alex jones farce . 1Am advocates, who i’m generally super critical of, have long fallen into this hole. Jones has a right to say an immense load of horrible shite so 1am advocates only talk about his rights. But most are loath to say jones is a human cesspool. Ken White is one of the few who does. Rights give you the ability to be an ahole. They don’t make being an ahole good or noble.Report

    1. The people who are loathe to call Alex Jones an asshole exist in a permanent state of shock the bourgeois attitude about them and think of the bourgeois establishment as being middle-class and upper-middle class winemom Democrats (how cringe). One of the the bad and lasting sideeffects of the counter-culture movements in my view is that it sort of created a permanent desire to be “anti-establishment” in a good chunk of the population. There are good reasons to be anti-establishment but a lot of it appears to be “anti-establishment” for reasons pulled from the butt. We also seem to be in an era of Schrodinger’s establishment where everyone is both and is not the establishment at the same time.

      Alex Lee Moyer who directed the recent Alex Jones documentary is a good example. She is a 38-year old woman who thinks people are just too deferential to authority these days. There is something about her attitude and pose which screams “I still want to be the disdainful, skateboarding, too cool for school punk in the back of class” even though she is a 38-year old woman. So she does pretzel logic to make Alex Jones be some kind of “anti-establishment” hero. Even though Alex Jones harasses the parents of murdered children.Report

      1. When the establishment embraces equality and dignity of the former Outgroup, fascists have no alternative but to go to war with the establishment.

        See schools, Boston Children’s Hospital, the DOJ or tech companies.Report

      2. i really don’t think 1a stans – of which i am very much one – shy away from saying “that person is a real blah blah blah blah” (in alex jones’ case, the correct description is a string of compound obscenities) but rather tend to focus on the law.

        so popehat, good example, has a lot of “no, you can’t ban hate speech or misinformation or any other factoid you just made up about the constitution, you bumbling idiots” because twitter is full of bumbling idiots on this front in particular who really want him to join the two minute hate and don’t want to think through their 20 seconds of tweeting because, well…it’s 20 seconds of tweeting.Report

        1. Apparently Greg thinks conservatives don’t call out the nuts on ostensibly their side. He should listen to Shapiro. If listening to one’s opponents isn’t a good use of time, then what do you call writing comments about them?Report

          1. I’ve listened to Shapiro. Childish, poor thinker and mostly just self righteous sh*tposter. I see a very few C’s call out the fire hose of shit on the right. The people that do are RINO’s or ex R’s.Report

              1. But then he misrepresented the right because he doesn’t know how Shapiro and others call out the people who deserve it. He can say he listens to the radio all the time but if he says that no stations play Queen, he’s demonstrating that he doesn’t know what he’s talking about. Seriously, it’s like We Will Rock You is on every time I flip the dial. They were never that good a band to begin with.Report

              2. If you don’t want to know what the other side is thinking, fine, but you probably shouldn’t try to describe it.

                given the number of right leaners around here who proudly and loudly avoid the centerists, much less the left, you might want to extend a bit more grace, especially when someone says they do in fact listen to your preferred source.Report

    2. “One part of is people failing to differentiate between the right to do something and whether is is good.”

      It’s like strapping on a big ol’ set of fake tiddies and going to work as a schoolteacher.Report

      1. Yeah so. The fake titties, afaik, is a twitter sensation and Streisand Effect example. Might be stupid or childish or whatever. Not really alex jones “lets spend years calling for the harassment of the parents of murdered children” bad but YMMV.Report

        1. There are people arguing, nonironically, at length, that this person has every right to wear prosthetic tits as large as they like and anyone who suggests this might be a problem in a school setting is only doing it because they’re transphobic bigots.

          “pfft, well, *I* haven’t heard of them”

          I submit to you that there are more things happening in the world than Just What Greg In AK Sees In Front Of Him.Report

      2. “It’s like strapping on a big ol’ set of fake tiddies and going to work as a schoolteacher.”

        Huh? Why is it different for a school teacher to get breast implants than anyone else?Report

  8. Gavin Newsom, showing how to govern without being a jerk:

    Newsom signs bill allowing California IDs for immigrants in the country illegally

    In a statement Friday, Newsom touted the bill, along with other legislation that would allow street vendors to more easily obtain local health permits and provide immigrant students with improved access to in-state tuition at public colleges and universities and to ESL courses at community colleges.
    In addition, he signed a bill that will provide low-income Californians, regardless of their immigration status, eligibility for legal assistance in civil matters affecting basic human needs.

    “California is expanding opportunity for everyone, regardless of immigration status,” Newsom said in a written statement. “We’re a state of refuge — a majority-minority state, where 27% of us are immigrants.”

    https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2022-09-27/newsom-bill-california-ids-immigrants-in-us-illegallyReport

  9. Nick Catoggio, the artist formerly known as Allahpundit at Hot Air, now writing for The Dispatch:

    The cardinal virtue of modern conservative populism is spite. Whatever gambit a populist is pursuing, whatever agenda he or she might be advancing, the more it offends the enemy the more likely it is to be received by the right adoringly. Ron DeSantis’ Martha’s Vineyard stunt is an efficient example. It accomplished nothing meaningful yet observers on both sides agree that he helped his 2024 chances by pulling it off. He made the right people mad. That’s more important than thoughtful policy solutions.

    A party that can’t decide what it wants on policy can at least converge on the belief that the libs are bad and that whatever irritates them must have value. So spite has become the glue that holds together an uneasy coalition of classical liberals, nationalists, country clubbers, hawks, and social cons.

    That’s what Carlson’s conditioning program is about, I think. He’s trying to cultivate in his audience an instinct to question—or spite—liberal pieties wherever they arise, from grand-scale geopolitics like “Russia is bad” to more pedestrian but no less correct beliefs like “Biker gangs are bad.”

    What is noteworthy here is what we’ve been discussing here- that the modern conservative movement isn’t defined by conventional “issues” or policy preferences that just anyone can adopt.

    It is defined by identity, and a hostility to a hated Outgroup, who can never become members of the Ingroup. Spite and reflexive contrarianism are its tools to shape and mold their Ingroup thinking.Report

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