Girl Dadding in the Taylor Swift Era

Andrew Donaldson

Born and raised in West Virginia, Andrew has been the Managing Editor of Ordinary Times since 2018, is a widely published opinion writer, and appears in media, radio, and occasionally as a talking head on TV. He can usually be found misspelling/misusing words on Twitter@four4thefire. Andrew is the host of Heard Tell podcast. Subscribe to Andrew'sHeard Tell Substack for free here:

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30 Responses

  1. Jaybird
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    says:

    My take on the Taylor Swift thing: when Swift is on tour, periodically some tweets from the Swifties make it all the way to my feed. They tend to take a particular form. 1-2 seconds on Taylor Swift then the camera turns around and the person yells into the camera about how “I’M AT A TAYLOR SWIFT CONCERT!” and the rest of the video is a monolog about being at a Taylor Swift show. “She’s so great! She’s so talented! She’s so amazing!”

    The video may then swing back around to show another 1-2 seconds of Taylor and it may not.

    Say what you will about fan videos shot at Great White concerts, they focus on the band and the pyro.Report

  2. Reformed Republican
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    says:

    Within the past few days I saw an article where Eddie Veder was talking about taking his daughter to a Taylor Swift concernt, and he was singing her praises and putting over the energy of the crowd.Report

  3. Philip H
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    says:

    I love my kids, my kids love Taylor Swift, I find no legitimate reason to not do so, therefore I listen to Taylor Swift. And Wildest Dreams is a banger. It slaps. Lit. Or something, whatever the kids say these days.

    I apologize for nothing.

    I have three daughters. I apologize for nothing either.

    And worth noting that her “In the Music Business” fans include the front man for Disturbed. If she’s good enough for metal, she’s good enough for me.Report

  4. Damon
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    says:

    Well, that read was five minutes I’ll never get back. 🙂

    I know of Taylor Swift. I know she’s a singer. I don’t care about her politics, her music, or who’s she’s dating. Growing up, I never cared about any band’s views on anything except for the music they produced. Anything else was irrelevant. I’ll never understand why people view entertainers as anything other than entertainers.Report

  5. Koz
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    says:

    And Wildest Dreams is a banger. It slaps. Lit. Or something, whatever the kids say these days.

    Gotta admit, I find Taylor Swift to be really frustrating, probably because I’m not really close to the Taylor Swift fandom.

    She’s so successful commercially, and musically she’s so mid. Can’t at least do a couple good, catchy pop songs a la Britney or Christina Aguilera?Report

    • Tortured Poet in reply to Koz
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      says:

      she’s far from being a mid… she can write catchy songs and more… if you want catchy songs..listen to Style, New Romantics, Out of The Woods, Blank Space, Red, Love Story, You Belong With Me, Sparks Fly, Getaway Car, Karma etc…but she’s can do much more…she’s a poet… her lyrics are basically poetry.. you don’t see popstars writing songs like she does now a days…. when it comes to song writing she’s up there with the greats… her critically acclaimed masterpiece albums like Folklore and Evermore are literal proof of testament to her talent in music… songs like The Lakes, My Tears Riccochet, Cardigan, Seven, Epiphany, Hoax, Willow, Ivy, False God, Champagne Problems, Tolerate It, Evermore, Cowboy Like Me, No, Body No Crime etc… I’d suggest u try out these songs before you judge her… even if the music ain’t ur cup of tea you can’t deny her pen game!Report

    • InMD in reply to Koz
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      says:

      I don’t like her music either. When I’m exposed to it at the gym or wherever I don’t even see how there could be some fun to it like I do with some of the other female pop acts. But then I am just an aging metal head.Report

      • North in reply to InMD
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        says:

        I found “You need to calm down” to be quite catchy and the message was also good. It was actually directed at hysterical scolds on both the right and left though, due to its music video, it drew most of its denunciations from the right so that balance got lost.Report

        • InMD in reply to North
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          says:

          Heh, while she isn’t my bag I find the politicization (by others) of her beyond preposterous. Overall though it doesn’t really bother me that music exists which does not cater to my taste. I’m sure most of the Swifties would think what I listen to sucks and that’s fine with me.

          I did find the tongue-in-cheek ‘feud’ over one of her album covers with Ihsahn (a legendary black metal musician) a few years ago to he pretty hilarious. Not sure if she ever responded to it but I give Taylor credit, the cover in question was really metal.

          https://www.kerrang.com/ihsahn-responds-to-taylor-swifts-new-album-cover-looking-rather-similar-to-hisReport

          • Brandon Berg in reply to InMD
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            says:

            My aunt went through a month-long phase where she would spend all day reposting obnoxious Facebook posts about how Taylor Swift was triggering conservative snowflakes, making their heads explode, and sodomizing their corpses, or something like that.Report

          • CJColucci in reply to InMD
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            says:

            it doesn’t really bother me that music exists which does not cater to my taste.

            An unusually mature attitude, which can be extended to all sorts of things. And which would make the world a quieter, less silly place.Report

            • North in reply to CJColucci
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              says:

              What would people talk about on the internet then!?!?!?Report

              • Jaybird in reply to North
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                says:

                Reverse gatekeeping.

                “You’re not allowed to like that! It’s not for you!”Report

              • Em Carpenter in reply to Jaybird
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                says:

                More like “who cares if you don’t like that? It’s not for you.”Report

              • Jaybird in reply to Em Carpenter
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                says:

                The problem with that one is that I have been told such things before about stuff that I, more or less, considered to be vaguely around the target audience.

                Gamergate #1 had, among other things, the whole “Gamers are Dead” media blitz where several different outlets all printed variants of “Gamers don’t have to be your audience anymore!” to various game publishers. And so if there was a video game that came out and I complained about this or that about it, I got told, you guessed it, “who cares if you don’t like that? It’s not for you.”

                Well, a number of games did poorly. A handful of studios closed.

                I mean, if a video game goes out of its way to not appeal to basement-dwelling computer dorks who may or may not be a little bit Aspy, well… it had better have a *VERY* well-defined audience because, if it’s just trying to prove a point, it’ll turn into an argument about how thin-skinned I am for not buying a product that I didn’t like because it wasn’t for me.

                Which, lemme tell ya, was an even dumber conversation than it sounds like it would have been.Report

              • CJColucci in reply to North
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                says:

                Feature, not bug.Report

            • KenB in reply to CJColucci
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              says:

              Even though I understand that different people will like different kinds of music, my first unguarded reaction to a lot of popular music is “OMG how can anyone like that crap???”. It takes a few seconds for the more rational part of my brain to kick in and remind me that other people have their own backgrounds and experiences and taste, and that my confidence in the absolute rightness of my own reaction is unjustified (sometimes).

              I liked the occasional “argue about food/sports/music/etc.” posts that used to be more common here (e.g. the Mt Rushmore series), because it seemed like a helpful reminder for people who were generally busy getting angry at each other for “serious” political disagreements that they could find themselves getting just as worked up about disagreements that everyone intellectually understood were just matters of taste and not fact. So that maybe on some level when they went back to arguing about politics, a little bit of that realization would transfer over and there would be a bit less outrage and a bit more empathy in the mix.Report

              • CJColucci in reply to KenB
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                says:

                It’s a bit easy to say that something is only a matter of taste. The concept of “you don’t know what you’re missing” has some validity if the person you’re talking to has had little exposure to whatever you’re talking about, though if someone has had some exposure, given something an honest try, and still doesn’t like it, that must be the end of the matter. Sometimes, too, there can be agreed-upon objective criteria that are independent of taste. You still may not like something, but you can’t say it sucks, just that it’s not for you.
                I have found my life a lot more pleasant and interesting after substituting: “I don’t get X” for “X sucks” about various things.Report

      • Michael Cain in reply to InMD
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        says:

        When I was an undergraduate I met a woman who was doing her PhD dissertation in the music department on “sing-along rock.” I initially understood it intellectually, but didn’t really get how it could be a thing. She took me as far as the elevator lobby on a floor in the women’s dorm. Most doors were open; everyone’s radio was tuned to the same station; you could hear a whole bunch of women singing along, including people doing the harmony.

        I’m sure that over the years those women poured a fair amount of money into artists/groups that did rock that invited the listener to sing along, and their metal head boyfriends had no clue what the attraction was.Report

        • J_A in reply to Michael Cain
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          says:

          I sign along to Meatloaf over and over and over in my car. I might restart the same song up to ten times before I move to the next.

          It’s fishing fun

          And last I checked, like this morning, I have guy bits 🙂

          P. S. And I was born when the Cuban Missiles crisis was also known as “last month”.Report

      • Koz in reply to InMD
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        says:

        Yeah, that’s basically me, except for the metal part. Taylor Swift makes me get in touch with my inner “get off my lawn” to the kids these days. Like check this out:

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZInRE-KryGA

        The 80s tune, the Rosie Riveter motif switch. Horrible production values. Just so much cooler than anything I’ve heard from Taylor, yet Pat Benetar was what, third or fourth tier back then?Report

        • InMD in reply to Koz
          Ignored
          says:

          Heh comparing her to Pat Benetar just isn’t fair to Taylor. Pat also has her husband helping out on guitar which is what gives her sound that rock edge to it.Report

  6. CJColucci
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    says:

    I wouldn’t recognize a Taylor Swift song if you put a gun to my head. She appears to be a nice person, and she obviously works very hard to entertain her audience, which I respect. (I could say much the same about Beyonce, though I do recognize the song about putting a ring on it.) I wish her nothing but the best with Travis Kelce. Her music doesn’t move me, but that’s about me, not her. I’m having trouble seeing why I should go to the trouble of having more of an opinion than that, let alone share it with the world as if anyone should care.Report

  7. Jaybird
    Ignored
    says:

    Okay. For them what don’t know Taylor Swift, I’m of the opinion that “Red” was her best album and each album since hasn’t been quite as good as the one before. Red was very, very good, though.

    Here are the songs that you should know from it (and I’d guess that most know at least one of these):

    “Everything Has Changed” was the song that made me the most excited when I looked at the CD because I thought “OH MY GOSH SHE’S COVERING ELBOW’S SONG ‘MIRRORBALL‘!!!” and, as it turns out, she wasn’t. Which is a bummer because I think that she’d do well with that song.

    Though, now that I think about it, it’s probably more of a Lana Del Rey song. It’s got that melancholy thing going.

    Anyway. Everything has changed was a song she did with Ed Sheeran. Wait. A step up from “with”. “Featuring”.

    You probably also heard her song 22. It’s fun, it’s catchy… I kinda hoped that Weird Al would have picked it up and did an Amish cover of it… “I don’t know about thee… but I’m feeling 23!”

    The one that I’d bet a dollar that everybody heard because, seriously, it was *EVERYWHERE* is “We Are Never Getting Back Together”.

    Her next album, 1989, wasn’t as good but there was one song on there that was *REALLY* good and it was “Style”.

    There. Those are probably her best songs (though I’m sure that others will yell “WHAT ABOUT THIS ONE” and point to “Shake it Off” or “Look What You Made Me Do” or whatever).

    The main takeaway that I have from her stuff is that it’s upbeat and optimistic and even her angryish songs are fun and upbeat and she’s going to get over this other guy and, you know what, it’s *HIS* loss. Definitely sanguine.

    Mid? Only if you’re of a different humor.Report

  8. DensityDuck
    Ignored
    says:

    Taylor Swift has achieved the feat of being incredibly appealing to both teenage girls and middle-aged dads.

    Like, all those dudes at the concert, they’re there with their kids but they’re not just there with their kids, get me?Report

  9. Wagon
    Ignored
    says:

    I’m the father of an almost teenage daughter who loves Taylor Swift. I don’t have a problem with it. She’s relatively wholesome and traditional compared to a lot of popular music. Her songs are about wanting to fall in love and ride off in the sunset, the hurt of failed relationships, etc. The whole Travis and Taylor thing was the same. She was in a very public relationship with a traditionally masculine guy. It got my daughter and wife interested in the NFL, which is good.

    Probably the only gripe I have about her is that her lyrics and music are mostly teenage girl drama all the time. And I don’t necessarily want to encourage that sort of thing. Like the line about “promise to always be overdramatic” from Lover. No, don’t be overdramatic. Being overdramatic isn’t good. I also don’t care for how much sexualization there is in her more recent albums, but she’s a 30-something year old woman and, again, it’s extremely tame by today’s standards in a lot of popular music. “Tangled in bedsheets” and “the shape of your body” v. “WAP.” And I feel pretty confident that Swift will not be twerking on stage in a thong or singing about her lady lumps.

    So, all in all, there are much worse things my daughter could be into, and where I have problems with it, it’s a teaching opportunity, a chance to teach how to evaluate and discern.

    Also, I didn’t end up a junkie or commit suicide despite years of listening to Nirvana, Alice in Chains, STP, GNR, Smashing Pumpkins, Pearl Jam, or all the other grunge bands of the ’90’s. So, the kids will be alright.Report

  10. Fish
    Ignored
    says:

    Thanks for writing this, Andrew. I agree with nearly all of it, but take exception to one piece: the best of her catalogue is obviously “Shake It Off.” Or maybe “You Belong With Me.” But we can’t forget “Bad Blood,” either. Eh, whatever. Well done.Report

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