Win it Warren

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21 Responses

  1. Avatar DensityDuck
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    says:

    She name-checked indian reservations in her closing statement; do you figure that was more of a “checklist of disadvantaged people” or a deliberate call-out?Report

  2. Avatar Chip Daniels
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    says:

    As I mentioned in other threads, Trump helps Warren’s cause.

    I mean, its tough to make the case that Warren’s Socialism is wrong only because it doesn’t contain enough Nationalism.

    “We want the government to take control of the factors of production and distribute them to the peasants! No, not those peasants, us peasants over here!”Report

  3. Avatar CJColucci
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    says:

    I take it as given that, for better or worse, the Full Liz Agenda, like the Full Bernie Agenda, will not pass, and we will, at best, get some reasonable improvements in their respective directions. I treat the Full Agendas as opening bids, and decline to get into the weeds about the details of this proposal or that. The question for me is not so much what is in the candidates’ position papers, but how they will restore honest, fact-based administration, who will staff up their governments, how good a job they will do on attaining what is attainable without leaving money on the table, and whether they can make America a grown-up on the world stage again. And, most important, can they beat Trump? Most of the candidates seem acceptable to me, none is my Platonic ideal. I wait and hope to see.Report

  4. Avatar Brandon Berg
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    says:

    In brief, she is smart and knows her shit.

    This is the same Elizabeth Warren who went viral by not understanding why overnight, fully-secured loans have lower interest rates than long-run, unsecured loans?

    As I recall, she also got famously confused about the difference between the average productivity of all workers and the marginal product of minimum wage workers.Report

    • Avatar Brandon Berg in reply to Brandon Berg
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      says:

      To be fair, this is not inconsistent with being smart and knowing her shit! As a former law professor, economics isn’t her shit. But her agenda is pretty heavily economics-focused, and on that front, she seems to be very highly in sync with my least-informed acquaintances.Report

      • Avatar Vikram Bath in reply to Brandon Berg
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        says:

        I think you’re basically right here. People keep insisting she is ridiculously smart and has detailed plans, but I don’t see her plans as reflecting a lot of thought. This is true of a lot of candidates, of course, but I don’t generally hear people talk about how brilliant Bernie Sanders is as I do hear about WarrenReport

    • Avatar Mr.Joe in reply to Brandon Berg
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      says:

      I missed the Warren doesn’t understand how interest rates work thing. Can you point me to where this was?

      Is this about her failed student loan bill? If so, it seems like a gross mischaracterization to me. But such things go viral all the time.Report

      • Avatar George Turner in reply to Mr.Joe
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        says:

        US News: What Elizabeth Warren gets wrong and right about student loans

        She wanted them set at 0.78%, but their default rate is similar to credit cards.

        A worse issue is her wealth tax. If your money is bonds and she’s taxing it at a rate comparable to or higher than the interest rate you’re getting, once you factor in inflation, you’d be better off putting your money in your mattress. The same is true for stocks.

        Unlike other revenue streams, she intends to tax your capital, not your interest, and at even very low tax rates that changes the calculus dramatically. Trillions of dollars would be withdrawn from the stock market and the likely result would be a deep crash followed by a depression.

        She is not smart. Not smart at all.Report

  5. Avatar Jaybird
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    says:

    So I read your essay and I understand that you like Warren and you dislike Trump, but I didn’t really walk away with a reason to vote *FOR* her rather than why she’d be just as good a choice for not-Trump as any.

    In brief, she is smart and knows her shit.

    This applies to every candidate up there, from Yang to Williamson. Why should I vote for *WARREN*?

    Elizabeth Warren considers her self a capitalist.

    While this doesn’t apply to everybody up there (Bernie, maybe Williamson), it applies to most of them. Why Warren?Report

    • Avatar Saul Degraw in reply to Jaybird
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      says:

      1. I don’t think President is an entry-level political job and Donald Trump proves this. Elizabeth Warren is a senator.

      2. She has much bigger policy chops than Yang and Williamson.

      3. Williamson might seem warm and fuzzy but she is anti-vaxx curious and that is bad from a public health prospective.

      4. This essay on Williamson from Bertlasky is on point:

      https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/marianne-williamson-s-democratic-debate-performance-raised-eyebrows-she-s-ncna1035956

      “But this supposedly empowering rhetoric masks a mean-spirited individualism. Williamson, like conservative thinkers, often blames material problems on personal failures. Her ideology may sound airy and inoffensive, but it is ultimately one of neoliberal victim shaming. And it would lead to harmful policies if she were, by some miracle, to be elected to public office.”

      In the 1980s she was telling gay men that were HIV positive that it was their fault for getting the virus.

      5. You already admitted that you were probably not voting for the Democratic candidate. I don’t find your “I might do this if I find an oddball candidate” persuasive or impressive.Report

      • Avatar Jaybird in reply to Saul Degraw
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        says:

        I asked you about why I should vote for Warren and you talked about Yang and Williamson.

        You’re not giving me reasons to vote for her, Saul. You’re giving me reasons to vote against Trump and vote against Yang and vote against Williamson.Report

        • Avatar DensityDuck in reply to Jaybird
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          says:

          “You’re giving me reasons to vote against Trump”

          But isn’t that enough of a reason, Jaybird? I mean what difference, at this point, does it make? Elizabeth Warren is reporting for duty!Report

        • Avatar Mr.Joe in reply to Jaybird
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          says:

          @jaybird – Let me add a few reasons to vote *FOR* Warren.

          CFPB – This is a major accomplishment that she carries a significant share of the blame/responsibility for. This was done without any real power. This was her idea and likely would have died without her work to keep it both alive and viable. She can build coalitions and get policy implemented.

          She has a decade of the hard right attacking her. She is still standing and they have little to show for it. The only things I can think of that remotely stuck are “Pocahontas” and “You didn’t build that”.

          Being a harvard professor I expect that she is well versed in laying smackdown on fratboy antics in ways that get heard by fellow fratboys. I expect that she is probably one of the best suited to handle debates with Trump.Report

  6. Avatar Chip Daniels
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    says:

    I’m still undecided but narrowing down to Harris or Warren.
    For me, they both are the most skilled in communicating the contemporary liberal position in terms nonliberals can grasp and find agreeable.
    The rest of the candidates seem like they are channeling 1990 era Bill Clintonism.Report

  7. Avatar North
    Ignored
    says:

    I have plenty of respect for Warren but when she raised her hand for abolishing private insurance I downgraded her from vying for my #2 spot to a distant fifth. One can argue about it policy wise but it’s utter poison politically. I just don’t think she’ll be the most effective candidate against Trump.

    It also -really- doesn’t help that if she wins the GOP governor of her state gets to appoint a republican Senator to replace her.Report

    • Avatar Saul Degraw in reply to North
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      says:

      The second paragraph is why I go back and forth between Warren and Harris. I am starting to wonder if a lot of our messes have moral fixes that are politically untenable in the short term.Report

  8. Avatar Mike Dwyer
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    says:

    “Are you tired of the Presidency being dominated by people from the Ivy League? Elizabeth Warren received her undergrad degree from the University of Houston and her law degree from Rutgers Law School. Both of these are public institutions. She is the rare person to make it from public schools to an Ivy League professorship.”

    If you are tired of the Presidency being dominated by Ivy League graduates you should totally vote for someone that was a professor there instead!

    Ugh…Report

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