Freedom of Movement


Christopher Carr

Christopher Carr does stuff and writes about stuff.

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11 Responses

  1. Avatar Damon says:

    Yah know, adding 1% of your total population a year from immigration does tend to raise some eyebrows. Especially if there is no end in sight.Report

    • Avatar Kim says:

      Good for the economy though.Report

      • Avatar Damon says:

        “Good for the economy” @kim? Maybe. But given that there are a lot of Syrian immigrants fleeing with nothing…who do you think is going to support them? The German tax payer. @christopher-carr And maybe the Germans don’t want a massive flood of new folks settling down in their country and have lots of kids.Report

        • Avatar Christopher Carr says:

          So then, @damon, you seem like someone who, relatively speaking, does not support freedom of movement. And yes, natives not wanting immigrants breeding has happened before, in Germany of all places too.Report

          • Avatar Damon says:

            Actually, I support free movement. What I don’t support is uncontrolled immigration. Yes, this is where I deviate from the Libertarian position, but you can’t have uncontrolled immigration, nation states, and a welfare system all at the same time.

            If the Germans want to only allow 5 foot male Greeks who own a BMW and have have blue hair, that’s Germany’s call. Same goes everywhere else.

            Oh, and Godwin’s law.Report

            • Avatar Christopher Carr says:

              Godwin’s law doesn’t apply here, because I’m talking about actual Hitler in Germany and not making a comparison of something to Hitler. Hitler was very much in favor of freedom of movement for German Aryans – into Poland, for example – but not in favor of freedom of movement for swarthy inferior races.

              Unfortunately, Germany cannot decide alone who gets to live in its borders, because it is part of a federation that allows for freedom of movement from member state to member state. Of course, Germany is happy to benefit from nations like Hungary, just unwilling to take any responsibility for Hungary’s problems. With regards to German power within the European Union, I’m reminded of a line from Batman.Report

              • Avatar Damon says:

                “Germany cannot decide alone who gets to live in its borders, because it is part of a federation that allows for freedom of movement from member state to member state. ”

                True indeed. But so what. Just what is the EU going to do if Germany suddenly decided no more migrants? Invade with the EU army? Impose sanctions? Pass a stern resolution? Kick them out of the EU? And maybe, the Germans might decide, if the EU did some of that, they’d be better off outside the EU.Report

  2. Avatar notme says:

    There is freedom of movement but there is also letting your country be over run by foreigners. It looks as if the Europeans are going to let happen through lax immigration what the Ottoman Turks couldn’t achieve.Report

  3. Avatar Kolohe says:

    Europe may be vacillating on its commitment of freedom of movement for non-ethnic Europeans. Which is really not that big of a policy change. (though people are starting to rebuild some of the fences and walls). The Schengen Area has always been a ‘united states of europe’ idea but predicated on the assumption that entering or exiting the Schengen area *is* controlled through traditional visa and customs controls.

    The chunnel fiasco is more illustrative than this story, in my opinion. In this story, it’s Germany being the good guys and Austria and Hungary playing the heavies. It’s fine to ding Austria, but Hungary, like the most of the rest of Eastern Europe (read:the former Communist Bloc) is still only playing with one fourth to one third of the GDP per capita that ‘Western’ Europe is able to bring to bear. 13.5K for Hungary vs 46.5K for Germany (and about same for Austria).Report

  4. Avatar Will Truman says:

    This files under the category “The arrangement of the EU is not that of the USA.”

    Before I read the headline, I actually thought it might be Cameron’s attempt to limit the number of Polish and Eastern Europeans.

    So long as the EU remains a collection of nations, instead of a nation unto itself, there is going to be a lot of push and pull. Especially around such hot-button topics as immigration.Report